[han]

AQ9
KQ10987
AK
Jx

1H-p-1NT-p
??

1NT is forcing, you are not playing Riton 2C.

[Free]

3♥, wtp? Btw, after some discussion about 2♣ openers, it seems like you have a hand which can probably open 2♣ as a semiGF in ♥. I can find 8 tricks...

[Chamaco]

3NT

[whereagles]

Yeah.. what's wrong with 3♥?

[SoTired]

whereagles, on Sep 12 2005, 04:11 AM, said:

Yeah.. what's wrong with 3♥?

Welll... for one, it is not forcing. I would think with 19 you want to force to game.
We are playing 2/1, right?

2N = 17-19 and is a near game force
3N = 15-17 with a solid 6-card suit
3H = about 16 with a good 6-card suit
2S = forcing 1round and only promises that hearts are longer than spades

Therefore, best choice is between 2N or 2S.
I vote for 2N

[Flame]

Are you really serious asking what wrong with 3H ?

[whereagles]

Well, unless I agreed with pard that 3NT shows this hand, there's really not much more I can do than bidding 3♥. I like wierd bids, but I'm not the sort of person who would invent a 2♠ reverse here. Though it's a perfectly ok way to bid the hand if you like it.

Incidently, I would have opened it 2♣, but 1♥ is ok too.

[pbleighton]

"Incidently, I would have opened it 2♣, but 1♥ is ok too."

I think this isn't consistent with rebidding 3H. To make a NF bid after pd has bid, on a hand you think good enough for a GF opener makes no sense. Either bid is OK in isolation, but if you think the hand is worth 2C, you must make a forcing bid now.

I would have opened 1H and rebid 2S. I *never* do this, but the alternatives are worse. 2N is closest, but it hides your 6 card suit.

Nice post, Hannie.

Peter

[inquiry]

2♠. This hand is too good for 3♥.

2♣ opening bid, if your system allows it, is also not too much of stretch with this hand, expecially since you can anticipate the rebid problem if partner responds 1NT.

[Flame]

3H isnt a strong bid, some play it 14-16 some 15-17 but never heard anyone play this as forcing, this is the lie in 2/1 system, there isnt a bid in the system that show this hand, but we prefer to ignore it cause strong hands are rare(this is why ppl think 2/1 is easier then strong clubs, because they ignore the grey areas), and when they come we lie with some reverse bid and hope for good. Two other alternatives are instead of calling it a lie make an aggrement that solve this hand, this could be just knowing reverse dosnt have to be real , or better play as most italians, save a bid to those hands either gazilli or first reverse, is either nat or any strong hand without other bidding which is usually either too strong for 3M or too strong for 3 level support. The other way to solve it is more simple and more natural bid 4 to show 18+ hcp.

[han]

My partner bid 3H in a flash, probably thinking WTP?

I had a terrible hand for him, Jxx x J10xx KQ10xx, so his extreme conservatism could have paid off. No such luck, everything was lying favorably and he made 4.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

4H, I know what I wanna play:
game and I know which suit: hearts.

Chances for slam are fairly low,
if partner holds one of the stronger
versions, he will make a move most
of the time, when its right , ... not
always, but thats the price I am willing
to pay to minimize the time we need for
this particular hand.
I think 2S is ok, but it woul not have
occurred to me at the table.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[ritong]

hi :-)

han quotes me in his initial post (riton 2!♣ is my baby), so i guess i have to add my two cents here
the disparity of answers indicates there is no really obvious choice, and this is the basic sense of the artificial 2♣ rebid han evocates, meaning " i m stuck".
this will be followed with 3♥, depicting a hand between 1♥ 1NT 3♥ and a strong opening.
frenchies have two strong openings, 2♦ game forcing and 2♣ which is either 22/23 balanced or any "strong two".
this hand belongs to the last, so would be treated that way by a french style tenant.
there is a thread called " gazzilli" on this forum where you can find about riton 2♣.

friendly
henri.

[whereagles]

Well, what I mean is that, having opened 1♥, I prefer the slight underbid of 1♥-1x-3♥ to a pseudo-reverse of 2♠. Actually, this is the sort of hand I prefer opening 2♣, precisely to avoid the rebid problem.

In this case the 3♥ rebid turned out to be ok move, as game is not odds-on (though it's a lucky make).

[ritong]

http://forums.bridge...?showtopic=7444

(have to scroll some

[Flame]

whereagles, on Sep 12 2005, 09:48 AM, said:

Well, what I mean is that, having opened 1♥, I prefer the slight underbid of 1♥-1x-3♥ to a pseudo-reverse of 2♠. Actually, this is the sort of hand I prefer opening 2♣, precisely to avoid the rebid problem.

In this case the 3♥ rebid turned out to be ok move, as game is not odds-on (though it's a lucky make).

YOu contradict yourself, you say its close to 2c and on the other hand you say its close to 3h, there is huge gap between 2c and 3h like 2 tricks gap.
you cant be close to both.

this is 2c :
Ax KQJXXX AX AKJ
this is 3H :
xx KQJXXX xx AKJ

[Fluffy]

2NT, GF, what's the problem?