[paulg]

The system files for all Bermuda Bowl partnerships are available on the Ecats Bridge site.

[cicus]

Thanks for the link. Interesting to see that Meckstroth-Rodwell seem to have abandoned the mini NT.

Gábor

[ArcLight]

>Thanks for the link. Interesting to see that Meckstroth-Rodwell seem to have abandoned the mini NT.


I'm curious as to why, since they have used it for a while.

[Chamaco]

ArcLight, on Sep 13 2005, 01:51 PM, said:

>Thanks for the link. Interesting to see that Meckstroth-Rodwell seem to have abandoned the mini NT.


I'm curious as to why, since they ahve used it for a while.

In this interview, you can find some thoughts declared by Eric Rodwell about NT ranges

http://www.bridgemat...com/rodwell.htm

[Amonias]

Interesting reading all the System files.
I have a question.
Why is New Zealands Reid-Newell "Comic 1NT overcall" a Brown sticker
and why is USA1 Meckstroth-Rodwell "Gardner 1NT overcall" not a Brown sticker?

Both overcalls could have a "natural" 1NT overcall or a weak hand with a long suit.

[paulg]

Amonias, on Sep 21 2005, 08:33 AM, said:

Interesting reading all the System files.
I have a question.
Why is New Zealands Reid-Newell "Comic 1NT overcall" a Brown sticker
and why is USA1 Meckstroth-Rodwell "Gardner 1NT overcall" not a Brown sticker?

Both overcalls could have a "natural" 1NT overcall or a weak hand with a long suit.

Historical reasons.

The Gardener No Trump Overcall is described in the Guide to Completion of WBF Convention Cards (PDF) where there is a subsequent comment:

Quote

Note: Although this fits the strict definition of a "Brown Sticker" convention, its widespread notoriety and history qualify for eligibility in all WBF events.

However you do have to play it exactly as described. The Kiwi's Comic 1NT can be a 1-, 2- or 3-suited weak hand, so it is Brown Sticker.

Cheers

Paul

[Gerben42]

Quote

Note: Although this fits the strict definition of a "Brown Sticker" convention, its widespread notoriety and history qualify for eligibility in all WBF events.

This kind of regulations make me throw up. Obviously what conventions are allowed depends on who your friends are. No more exceptions!

[Amonias]

Thank you Paul for your answer About The Gardener No Trump
"Historical reasons.

The Gardener No Trump Overcall is described in the Guide to Completion of WBF Convention Cards (PDF) where there is a subsequent comment:"
Note: Although this fits the strict definition of a "Brown Sticker" convention, its widespread notoriety and history qualify for eligibility in all WBF events.


But in the WBF System Policy 2002 We have a definition of a Brown Sticker overcall
"An overcall of a natural opening bid of one of a suit that does not promise at least four cards in a known suit.
EXCEPTION: A natural overcall in no trumps.
EXCEPTION: any cue bid suit that shows a strong hand.
EXCEPTION: a jump cue bid in opponent’s known suit that asks partner to bid 3NT with a stopper in that suit."
If the System policy group is listing Exceptions from this rule why are there no list of Conventions that by Historical reasons should be excluded from being a Brown Sticker. If they are making an exception of a natural NT bid they probably would have mentioned Gardener 1 NT as an exception too.

So in 1999 they had historical reasons in the document and in 2002 they dont mention it!

[cf_John0]

cardsharp, on Sep 11 2005, 03:38 AM, said:

The system files for all Bermuda Bowl partnerships are available on the Ecats Bridge site.

Thank you very much.

[sartaj1]

Gerben42, on Sep 21 2005, 08:19 AM, said:

Quote

Note: Although this fits the strict definition of a "Brown Sticker" convention, its widespread notoriety and history qualify for eligibility in all WBF events.

This kind of regulations make me throw up. Obviously what conventions are allowed depends on who your friends are. No more exceptions!

After the revised definition of Brown Sticker (2002), i think that the Guide to CC completion is just an outdated document.

Which in turn makes MeckWell in breach of regulations.

Maybe some lawmaker can shed some light.

[mgoetze]

Well, you know, Multi 2♦ is a BSC too, but it is played at small club tournaments all over Europe...

[paulg]

sartaj1, on Sep 22 2005, 05:00 AM, said:

After the revised definition of Brown Sticker (2002), i think that the Guide to CC completion is just an outdated document.

Which in turn makes MeckWell in breach of regulations.

Maybe some lawmaker can shed some light.

Although there may be inconsistency between the Guide and the current Policy, the Guide is provided by the WBF with the current Convention Card Editor and so could be deemed to be their interpretation of that Policy.

I'm sure Meckwell are fine - and I also think that the Gardener 1NT is not what frightens most of their opponents

Paul

[paulg]

Gerben42, on Sep 21 2005, 01:19 PM, said:

Quote

Note: Although this fits the strict definition of a "Brown Sticker" convention, its widespread notoriety and history qualify for eligibility in all WBF events.

This kind of regulations make me throw up. Obviously what conventions are allowed depends on who your friends are. No more exceptions!

Sometimes conventions get licenced in a country (or Zone) that perhaps should not have been. However, they become so popular within the mainstream bridge community (that is, the clubs) that to withdraw them becomes impossible.

After a few years even the ACBL feels that they can authorise them for their players, at which point I feel that the convention is sufficiently well understood that it would be strange not to let people play it on the world stage.

As mgoetze says, the best example of this is the Multi 2♦.

I think the lawmakers are just being practical and addressing the requirements of their market, so it does not annoy me at all. However, I wish they would put the exceptions into the Policy so that we could all see them!

Paul

[Amonias]

To mgoetze
2 di MULTI is NOT a Brown Sticker.
its an exception

In WBF System Policy 2002

"The following conventions or treatments are categorised as 'Brown Sticker':
a) Any opening bid of two clubs through three spades that:
i) could be weak (may by agreement be made with values below average strength) AND

ii) does not promise at least four cards in a known suit.
EXCEPTION: The bid always shows at least four cards in a known suit if it is weak. If the bid does not show a known four card suit it must show a hand a king or more over average strength. (Explanation: Where all the weak meanings show at least four cards in one known suit, and the strong meanings show a hand with a king or more above average strength, it is not a Brown Sticker Convention.)
EXCEPTION: A two level opening bid in a minor showing a weak two in either major, whether with or without the option of strong hand types, as described in the WBF Conventions Booklet."

I have no problem with exceptions listed in the rules, but I have problem with Rules that have some hidden rules behind.