[DavidKok]

 pescetom, on 2024-December-19, 17:57, said:

On reflection I could live with either, and don't consider it that important... but I do think the 2♥ Red Flag is a marginal winner at MP.

[..]

[O]ver here you can announce "strong" and open 2♣ on any hand you feel is worth a game force, so quite often the rest of the field will be in 2♣-2♦- single suit destined by an unlucky deal to go down 1 if they bid unconditionally to game.

[..]

A good start is to recognise that this opening is a minefield, use it for strong balanced hands and very strong single suiters and open 1 in a suit otherwise. You can add in some other shapes (or not) as you get more experienced.

These points are not entirely unrelated
There's so little space over 2♣, I am not spending it on finding a partscore. That's such a tricky gamble. The double negative also helps on slam investigation so the whole system discussion is far more complicated, but at least the 2♣-opening-that-wants-to-hit-the-breaks is, in my opinion, best not handled by the continuation scheme but instead by the opening agreements.

[pescetom]

 DavidKok, on 2024-December-20, 01:37, said:

These points are not entirely unrelated
There's so little space over 2♣, I am not spending it on finding a partscore. That's such a tricky gamble. The double negative also helps on slam investigation so the whole system discussion is far more complicated, but at least the 2♣-opening-that-wants-to-hit-the-breaks is, in my opinion, best not handled by the continuation scheme but instead by the opening agreements.

They are certainly related, in particular to the central point about how aggressively the field will bid 2C. My experience is that being able to stop in a partial is an occasional winner (or at least a good score shared with others) whereas missing a slam opposite a quacky Red Flag has not happened yet.

But I agree that here we are discussing marginal gains in the first place, not something that should concern N/B who should concentrate on the basic task (and weaknesses) of 2C.

[thepossum]

I don't know about standards but I have only one GF bid available so I use it

1 or even 2 tricks short ofgame and above

Some of us miss strong 2s, but understand their limited use so 1-2 tricks short of game

And it is clearly stated on my card. GF

Can cause trouble with robots and other bean counters

I know I am not an expert but it is the only bid that does not allow my partner to pass - so I use it as such

I accept with some hands I may just bid game immediately but always a risk of that being passed

I appreciate I am in NB and no expert but I think people should learn to bid their hands

[blackshoe]

When we open 2♣ the two overriding questions are: 1) Do we have a slam? and 2) Where are we going to play it?

If you play 2♥ bust, and responder bids 2♥, you have your answer to 1. As for 2) we play 2♦ waiting so partner can suggest an answer while hopefully making himself declarer. Also, when the answer to 1) is "no", the answer to "how high then?: is game.

OTGH, a couple of weeks ago one partner and I had a 2♣ auction where she started with 2♦, bid 2NT over my 2♠, and when I rebid 3♠ she left me there. I made 5. "I didn't like my hand" she said. :-(

[pescetom]

blackshoe, on 2024-December-25, 21:31, said:

OTGH, a couple of weeks ago one partner and I had a 2♣ auction where she started with 2♦, bid 2NT over my 2♠, and when I rebid 3♠ she left me there. I made 5. "I didn't like my hand" she said. :-(

Partners who cannot understand (or accept) the concept that a certain sequence is unconditionally game forcing are best left there.
OTOH, I too struggle to imagine a hand that would rebid spades rather than a second suit or NT in the above auction