[inquiry]

pclayton, on Jun 8 2005, 11:47 AM, said:

2H. Reading the earlier posts I was beginning to think I'd have lost my mind.

You really have to count hard to get to an 11 count, and this thing is drek with all those unsupported honors.

Zars aside, 6322's don't play well. The quacks - well they might be useful and they might not be. Sometimes you miss the 23 point 3NT with the 9 card major fit.

I also want to preempt with the heart suit when I have an excuse to.

Zar would pass this hand I am certain. First, he subtracts points for Jx and Qx. Second, even if you don't subtract points, this hand is only worth a crappy 26. Zar opens hands with six card major and 26 to 29 Zar points 2♥ and with seven card suit 3♥.

[Free]

My first thought was 2♥ opener, when I read some other posts I was starting to wonder, but I shouldn't doubt my first choice: 2♥. It's an aweful hand with ♥'s, and if the opponents have ♠s you'll never be able to show your 6 card. Reverse the Majors and I might open 1♠.

In any light opening system however, I'll open 1♥.

[HeartA]

I don't have a clear answer. I might open 1H on some day and 2H on another day, depending the status of match and the my mood.

[cherdano]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is that opening 2♥ will increase the chance of scoring your minor suit queens in case you end up defending. I really cannot stomach a pass here, and would open 2♥ if it is too light for our 1♥ openings.

Arend

[Chamaco]

cherdano, on Jun 9 2005, 02:41 AM, said:

Quote

One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is that opening 2♥ will increase the chance of scoring your minor suit queens in case you end up defending.

Compared to passing or to opening 1H ?

This statement looks unclear to me, but if it refers to the fact that opp declarer may have a harder time reading our hand, then passing will make it even harder :-)

Quote

I really cannot stomach a pass here....

Why ?
The ODR is terrible.

Passing will rarely risk missing game, because if pard cannot bid, this hand does not have the extra shape needed to get to game. Of course there are exceptions, but bridge is a % game.

So, the real risks of passing here are:

1- losing the partscore battle
when we could compete with 3H and opps bid 2S or soiemthing else

Alright, I know that the partscore battle is underestimated at IMPS; but here we are vulnerable and the overall hand quality sucks in offense.
I would not mind, with another hand with good ODR, risking some penalty, but here the cost-benefit at IMPS is too dangerous:
if we open 2H and we are wrong, the losses are way heavier than if we start with a pass and are wrong

2- not delivering a good heart lead to pard if we end up defending.

Again, in 3NT, pard should read the hand: we are marked with all the hcp, so pard is broke and he would surely try to hit our suit.
Things may be different in a suit contract, but again, there is not a clearcut evidence that a heart lead will be best.

3- In-quick out-quick

A common statement for light openings or weak 2s is that you are in-quick and out quick, and that if you opass such a hand, you'll feel compelled to show your values or shape at a later round, at a higher level, with greater risks.

I do not think it is the case here.
This 6322 is very much like a 5332, and even if I pass 1st round, I will happily pass even at later rounds, unless I have to balance OR pard makes a move.

Our shape is terrible. So, pard shape will probably be good, and if he has some value, he will come in.

4- Pressure bidding

Yes I know some bids put more pressure than others (and certainly more than pass ), however, as much as I love pressure bidding (and that I hate passing ), in some cases, the risks are too much.
I believe this is the case here.

Sure, I know that increasing the frequency of our weak 2s increases the pressure to opps, but there will be anyway hands that are unsuitable because too dangerous.
I believe this is one of such hands

5- what if we get doubled in 2H ?

This can turn out REAL bad.
The cost-benefit compared to some minor losses due to pass should convince that even if pass is wrong 2/3 of the times, it does avoid huge losses 1/3 of the times, so it is safest at IMPS, all vuln.

I am really puzzled by the fact that all the people who do not stand passing only illustrate the risks of passing but not the risks of bidding 2H.

I have some sympathy for the 1H bid, but I do not believe it has neither the playing strength of a 1H opener (it has 8 losers), nor the defensive tricks (2+) for a 1-level opener.

However, in 3rd seat, I'd prefer a 1H opener than a 2H opener, and pass any pard's rebid.

[Gerben42]

Quote

When I have a 6-card major, it is either a weak 2 or a 1 opener... Never pass (unless too weak for weak 2). I hate "backing in" to auctions. I personally open any 6-carder, but understand others who are squemish about xxxxxx suits.

Almost, but there are limits to what I accept as a weak two / one bid. An extreme case would be:

---

This is a clear PASS. How many flaws can you name

[Free]

Gerben42, on Jun 9 2005, 10:15 AM, said:

Quote

When I have a 6-card major, it is either a weak 2 or a 1 opener... Never pass (unless too weak for weak 2). I hate "backing in" to auctions. I personally open any 6-carder, but understand others who are squemish about xxxxxx suits.

Almost, but there are limits to what I accept as a weak two / one bid. An extreme case would be:

---

This is a clear PASS. How many flaws can you name

Playing MOSCITO, this is a clear 1♦ opening

[Gerben42]

Sure, agree with that Free. But not in standard.

[Chamaco]

Gerben42, on Jun 9 2005, 09:15 AM, said:

Almost, but there are limits to what I accept as a weak two / one bid. An extreme case would be:

Dealer:  ????? 
Vul:  Both 
Scoring:  Unknown 

♠  9743 
♥  A86432 
♦  A54 
♣


This is a clear PASS. How many flaws can you name

In my style (well, I do play limited openings ), this hand can indeed be opened 1H.

It does comply to the requirements for offense and defense:

1) 2+ defensive tricks
2) LTC: at most 7 losers (the hand has 7 losers) in offense

I totally agree that opening it a weak 2 seems indeed a pretty bad idea.

However, I do think that this hand has many more reasons to open 1H than the hand that started this thread : J8-AQ6432-Q3-Q98
In fact, such hand is insufficient fro BOTH viewpoints: defense and offense.
In offense, it has > 7 losers;
in defense, it has less than 2 defensive tricks.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi

I voted for 2H, but it is borderline.

I would prefer being red versus white, in which case 2H is
clearcut in my partnership, because in this case partner
will expect a 7 looser hand.
With red versus red, in my partnership partner will expect
only 8 looser, but becuase of the Queens, I downgrade it a
bit.

As a side note, for me, there is no hand, to strong for a weak
two and to weak to open.

With kind regards
Marlowe

PS: Having said the above, I would open 2H as well without
the Queens and the Jack.

[Chamaco]

P_Marlowe, on Jun 9 2005, 10:38 AM, said:

PS: Having said the above, I would open 2H as well without
the Queens and the Jack.

That would be less dangerous, IMO :-)

[42]

Mauro, did you notice? The number of passers dramatically increased to 4

[aisha759]

2 ♥, that's what I would open, playing sayc and acol... pass being my other option (depends on my mood at the time) I do vote on 2 ♥ though

Aisha