[pescetom]

MPs.

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Both sides are playing 5-card majors with strong NT in a style where a 1♣ opening is basically natural but may be short with 4-card major(s) and a 1♦ opening is never short but may be 4-4 in both minors.

E starts the ball rolling with 1♣ and now what do NS do?

If N passes, E will pass too.

Please answer the poll and express any related thoughts here.

[FelicityR]

I don't see the point of bidding hands that are essentially rubbish. Pass is a bid that is very underused.

[Tramticket]

North has an easy pass. Change the five of clubs to the King and I still pass.

But I will strain to bid in the pass-out seat when short in their suit. A protective 1D looks normal to me.

[KingCovert]

Having seen both the North and South hand, I'd venture that West holds something like a ~18 HCP hand with 4423 or 4432 shape, and East is holding therefore ~4 HCP with 2425 or 2434 shape.

So, A♠, K♠, Ruff a ♠, A♥ (hopefully on-side for the pitch of a club) and the A♦, and possibly a 2nd diamond. I'd play the suit small to the Queen, and then duck forcing out the doubleton Ace (hopefully again). Clubs can also be picked up if West leads them and holds the K. The problem here though is that East is theorized to have ~4 HCP, and well, I guess they could be 4 jacks.... But... something here is going to go wrong.

So, diamonds are probably an okay place to play, if opponents let you. I think the auction goes something like:

1♣ P P 1♦
X 2♦ 2♥ ?

Hard to say what South should do here. If PASS, then North will probably find their pass card too. 3♦ is suspect though. And, you may just be taking a plus if you pass 2♥. Partner can have as much as 14-15 HCP here. It's kind of hard to take a position that this hand is worth another bid, it's well described by the first balance of 1♦, which to answer the question, I do think should be made, precisely because partner actually has a worse hand than usual for this sequence.

[Cyberyeti]

FelicityR, on 2020-February-11, 10:49, said:

I don't see the point of bidding hands that are essentially rubbish. Pass is a bid that is very underused.

Indeed, bidding can be horribly wrong here.

KingCovert covers a lot of it. Diamonds may play really badly, but you don't want them to turn -70 or 90 into -100 or 110 at MPs.

[smerriman]

Tramticket, on 2020-February-11, 11:52, said:

But I will strain to bid in the pass-out seat when short in their suit. A protective 1D looks normal to me.

I do too.. but it seems every single time I do so over a 1♣ opener, I always end up regretting it. So I'm starting to pass them out more often.

[msjennifer]

Sir,a quick PASS ! whats the problem?

[Povratnik]

As North, I'd easily pass. As South I'd bid 1♦, if I knew that we have 9 diamonds and they have 8 clubs.
But in practice, I of course wouldn't know that. So I'd pass as South, hoping that partner has at least 4 clubs. I think the mathematical expectation strongly suggests pass...

[pescetom]

Thanks for the comments so far.

I was North and considered it an automatic pass, not even close. But then I like this double to show majors at least 4-3 which is not everyone's cup of tea I realise. South was aware of this but it is only the second time we played together in years so I don't expect him to feel unusual pressure to balance. I don't consider his hand rubbish in this context (it has some shape and controls, partner must be near opening strength and have some diamonds) but it certainly is weak and I can understand a pass.

What really pushed me to look for a reality check is that 1♣ making turned out to be a rotten score for us: just 37% at national level over 249 tables, which would have been 24% had they made +1 as they should. So at least one player at the table was on an unusual wavelength compared to much of the country.

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At 17 tables NS made a contract, at 69 EW made -70 or -90. At 93 tables EW went down -200 -300 or even -400.

Playing 20-21 2NT one might upgrade the West hand, and of course some pairs will be playing strong clubs. But I think most Wests will have bid a non-forcing 1♣ here and I guess some Easts would stretch to respond despite the vulnerability. So maybe it was East rather than South who started the squabble that often led to EW going down hard.