[FelicityR]

I don't believe that 'political point scoring' by comparing one country's covid-19 statistics with another will actually help anyone. We all know that Italy's and Spain's statistics are as honest as can be (sadly); and the UK's are honest but potentially flawed as until recently there was not widespread testing in this country.

As Winstonm said, social distancing seems the best way to contain the spread of the contagion. And widespread testing proves extra security. Here in the UK, it seems (and this is a very early indication) that the lockdown measures introduced just over a week ago, with the emphasis on social distancing are having some effect: a smaller percentage number tested positive for covid-19, and a smaller percentage have died, though that is only for the last three days. But that can change...

What annoys me more is world leaders ignoring the fact that this is a serious pandemic and trying to sweep it under the carpet. The Belarus president has reportedly said vodka and saunas will stop you getting coronavirus, and the Brazilian president is also in denial. Please wake up!

The British and American responses to covid-19 may have not been perfect, but at least both administrations are taking this seriously now. But, at the end of the day, it's up to the people in the country ultimately to take responsibility from the guidance they have been issued by their respective governments.

[johnu]

FelicityR, on 2020-March-30, 23:03, said:

As Winstonm said, social distancing seems the best way to contain the spread of the contagion. And widespread testing proves extra security.

US testing is far behind most other industrialized countries on a per thousand basis. In almost every section of the country, tests are strictly rationed. So much for extra security With 330 million people, it will be months if not years before we have the capacity to test everybody.

FelicityR, on 2020-March-30, 23:03, said:

The British and American responses to covid-19 may have not been perfect, but at least both administrations are taking this seriously now. But, at the end of the day, it's up to the people in the country ultimately to take responsibility from the guidance they have been issued by their respective governments.

The US response is still very mixed awful.

The Grifter in Chief has consistently downplayed the seriousness of the effects of the virus, and played up how early the country can get back to normal. This had led to a large gap in the percentage of Democrats and the percentage of Republicans who believe the situation is about to be catastrophic. Fox Propaganda and other right fringe media has been downplaying the seriousness of the situation for months, and if people are misled into thinking COVID-19 isn't that big a deal, they aren't going to protect themselves as well as they should, and by extension, endangering everybody else.

There is no national shelter in place order, and almost 20 states, most in the mountain, central and southern states which have Republican governors do not have statewide orders. The Republican governor of Mississippi issued an executive order which basically classified almost all businesses as essential and not subject to mandatory closure. And Florida, which has an extensive senior population, is on the verge a huge spike in cases and still doesn't have a statewide shelter in place order. If these areas of the country that currently have few cases don't do everything they can to "flatten the curve", the entire country could be inundated with critical care cases that swamps the medical system.

The distribution of personal protection equipment and ventilators is becoming more chaotic by the day without Federal oversight of the distribution systems. Hospitals are bidding for scarce equipment against other hospitals, states are competing with other states, and states are competing against the federal government. Somebody has to be in overall charge to determine which areas have immediate needs and which areas can wait a little longer. And the Defense Production Act wasn't used for the past 2 months and is still only being applied to 1 ventilator contract (and apparently wasn't actually needed as the 2 companies had already reached a contract).

[FelicityR]

johnu, on 2020-March-31, 01:17, said:

The US response is still very mixed awful.

Thank you, John, for detailing at length the US response. From what I am reading on this side of the Atlantic, I agree, too, that the US response has been less than satisfactory. And Donald Trump's comments and (lack of) actions were truly unhelpful.

And yes, having the resources to test the whole of the American population is a logistical nightmare.

Whilst I do not support Boris Johnson and the Conservative Party, I have to say that their response in the latter stages has been excellent, and the spirit of the British people has shone through, many volunteering to distribute grocery supplies or help the National Health Service. And the doctors and nurses tirelessly working within the NHS have been magnificent.

[Cyberyeti]

The numbers are going to be fairly meaningless. Data from Iceland (where they've done a lot of testing relative to the population size) suggests that half the cases are asymptomatic and a lot more have very mild symptoms.

Until mass runs of the antibody test are done, we won't know how many people have already had it.

One source https://english.alar...how-no-symptoms

[y66]

From Sam Jones at FT:

Quote

Austria is to join a small but growing number of European countries making the wearing of face masks outside the home compulsory amid shifting debate over the medical gear’s protective utility. 

Authorities would start distributing millions of free face masks at the entrances to all supermarkets from midweek onwards, chancellor Sebastian Kurz announced on Monday. Shoppers will only be permitted inside supermarkets and other open stores, such as pharmacies, if they are wearing masks.

While masks are a familiar sight throughout Asia, the only other countries in Europe to require the wearing of masks in public space are Slovakia, the Czech Republic and Bosnia-Herzegovina. 

The step would be a “learning phase” for further measures to come that would mandate the use of masks for any situation outside the home likely to bring people close to one another, Mr Kurz said on Monday.

“I’m fully aware that wearing masks is something alien to our culture,” he added. “Together we have to do everything [possible] so that we can quickly return to normalcy and a functioning economy.”

The move by Vienna comes as European governments devise ways to contain the spread of Covid-19 and keep it from re-emerging after their economies come out of their prolonged self-imposed lockdowns. It marks a departure from earlier official guidance. 

The WHO and many governments say healthy people do not need to wear a mask unless they are taking care of a person with suspected Covid-19 infection. The advice is partly an attempt to stop people who don’t need masks — which are in short supply in many places and needed by health workers — from trying to buy them.

The German government may enforce a similar obligation when it considers relaxing the lockdown measures, health ministry spokesman Hanno Kautz said on Monday, according to Reuters. Such masks could help protect others from contracting the illness from the wearer, Mr Kautz was quoted as saying. 

France initially advised its citizens not to wear masks, then advised they should wear one only if they were infected or if they worked in care or retail. The main reason was that the government chose to keep its short supplies for hospitals. 

But French trade unions representing shop assistants, factory workers and police officers have demanded safety equipment for all staff or else they would exercise their right to refuse to work in dangerous conditions. 

In Italy, where the outbreak has been the deadliest in the world, the wearing has within a month gone from attracting disapproving looks to being socially obligatory. 

The free masks delivered by the Austrian government will not meet the same medical standards as those used on the front line by doctors and nurses, but Vienna hopes that by forcing citizens to cover their noses and mouths in public, even if with simple barriers, will have a meaningful impact on transmission of the virus.

Advice from the Austrian government’s medical advisers indicates the new coronavirus is likeliest to be spread through larger droplets ejected by coughing and sneezing — which a rudimentary mask might impede — rather than in smaller aerosol particles that the body sheds through breathing alone that could only be stopped by more sophisticated means. The Red Cross has issued guidance in Austria to citizens on how they can make their own masks at home. 

“It would be a mistake to think that such masks protect you,” Mr Kurz added. “But the airborne transmission is somewhat reduced. This is not a substitute for [social] distancing.”

Austria’s has been among the most aggressive governments in Europe in taking action to curb public life in order to stop the pandemic: the approach — which has even included sequestering tourists in hotels in designated quarantine zones such as Tyrol — has yielded Mr Kurz’s government plaudits at home. It stands in contrast to the more laissez-faire approach adopted in the UK and Sweden. 

Police in Austria have rigorously enforced stay-at-home rules and movement restrictions: according to the interior ministry, more than 10,426 cautions have been given.

The government has said it will not even consider the rollback of restrictions until the daily growth rate of new coronavirus cases falls below 1 per cent. As of Monday morning, Austria had recorded 8,813 confirmed Covid-19 cases — with 108 deaths. The growth rate has decreased over the past two weeks, from roughly 40 per cent in mid-March, to 11 per cent. 

“The truth is, it’s a marathon and it’s not our job to just say what you want to hear,” Mr Kurz said.

[pescetom]

Today's statistics in Italy: positive 77635 (+3%), dead 12428 (+7%), no longer infected 15729 (+8%). Intensive care 4023 (+1%). Fatality rate 13.8%.
Looks like a confirmation of a second and lower plateau for he positive rate, but the fatality rate continues inexorably to rise.
Who knows how many are really positive, or even healed.
The Veneto region has begun random testing for antibodies, something which must have been done in China and should be public domain.

[FelicityR]

pescetom, on 2020-March-31, 14:44, said:

Today's statistics in Italy: positive 77635 (+3%), dead 12428 (+7%), no longer infected 15729 (+8%). Intensive care 4023 (+1%). Fatality rate 13.8%.
Looks like a confirmation of a second and lower plateau for he positive rate, but the fatality rate continues inexorably to rise.
Who knows how many are really positive, or even healed.
The Veneto region has begun random testing for antibodies, something which must have been done in China and should be public domain.

The positive rate in the UK remains at 14%, with over 25,000 positive now, but yesterday we had a huge spike in the number of deaths (+27%) with 381 people sadly succumbing to this illness. 1,781 have now died. Perhaps, in two weeks time, we will finally know whether the lockdown in the UK, and the strict social distancing and non-socialising measures in place have been effective. Our Prime Minster, Boris Johnson, warned yesterday the coronavirus epidemic will 'get worse before it will get better'. It's a grim prediction, but I believe it is better to be honest.

Here in the UK, the military have been instrumental in constructing the field hospitals very quickly that will take newer coronavirus cases. Already there's a remit that the worst cases, and those more at risk, will be treated in existing National Health Service hospitals, and that the less severe will be treated in the field hospitals.

[Cyberyeti]

FelicityR, on 2020-March-31, 23:59, said:

The positive rate in the UK remains at 14%, with over 25,000 positive now, but yesterday we had a huge spike in the number of deaths (+27%) with 381 people sadly succumbing to this illness. 1,781 have now died. Perhaps, in two weeks time, we will finally know whether the lockdown in the UK, and the strict social distancing and non-socialising measures in place have been effective. Our Prime Minster, Boris Johnson, warned yesterday the coronavirus epidemic will 'get worse before it will get better'. It's a grim prediction, but I believe it is better to be honest.

Here in the UK, the military have been instrumental in constructing the field hospitals very quickly that will take newer coronavirus cases. Already there's a remit that the worst cases, and those more at risk, will be treated in existing National Health Service hospitals, and that the less severe will be treated in the field hospitals.

Strange fact that nobody's satisfactorily explained but has been brought up several times. (In the UK) there seems to be a big spike on a Tuesday (reporting Monday's deaths) because the numbers flatten over the weekend so make it look bigger.

[PassedOut]

Cyberyeti, on 2020-March-31, 04:06, said:

The numbers are going to be fairly meaningless. Data from Iceland (where they've done a lot of testing relative to the population size) suggests that half the cases are asymptomatic and a lot more have very mild symptoms.

Until mass runs of the antibody test are done, we won't know how many people have already had it.

One source https://english.alar...how-no-symptoms

The whole testing situation in the US concerns me a lot. In mid-February I spent some time in San Jose, California visiting my youngest son, who works at a nearby tech company. Because of the virus there, lots of folks were wearing masks, and I did too, but not on the plane flights to and from San Jose. Later I learned that some of the TSA crew at the San Jose airport tested positive and that whole crew was sent home. On March 1, my youngest son flew from San Jose to work remotely from Constance's and my home. The next day he developed a fever and a cough, but the fever only lasted a few hours and he felt quite a bit better after a few days.

On March 9, I started coughing (no fever) and saw my doctor. Because I am in my 70s, have had asthma all my life, and need my blood pressure controlled, my doctor placed me in a high-risk group for the virus. With the lack of fever, though, both she and I considered it unlikely that I had the virus -- but she thought it a good idea for me to be tested anyway. I waited around for her to make the arrangements, but she found that I did not qualify for one of the (very scarce) tests because I didn't have a fever.

She made another call to a government official that we both know, who said that if I really wanted to be tested, he could make that happen. He and my doctor left the decision to me. I declined, not wanting use up a scarce test that I didn't really qualify for.

Right now eight family members live with us at our place, some working remotely. We're having everything delivered, only going out for walks (and avoiding other people then), washing hands incessantly, etc. Everyone here seems healthy, but I'm very aware now that it's possible that we might have had the virus and passed it on to others in early March. And I still don't know for sure! Argh.

[FelicityR]

PassedOut, on 2020-April-01, 10:31, said:

With the lack of fever, though, both she and I considered it unlikely that I had the virus...

I was reading an article this morning about Chinese coronavirus cases, and quite a few people test positive but display virtually no symptoms, thus being asymptomatic. As I said in a previous post, I am still convinced there's some other factor other than age and (ill) health - though these are the primary ones - that result in either an asymptomatic or a severe reaction to the virus. Until the medical world discover what mechanism makes covid-19 so deadly for some, or just mild for others, we should all keep safe until this pandemic is finally over.

[Winstonm]

There may be a hint of some better news about the virus as reported this a.m. in the New York Times:

Quote

By Denise Grady
April 1, 2020
Updated 1:20 p.m. ET


The malaria drug hydroxychloroquine helped to speed the recovery of a small number of patients who were mildly ill from the coronavirus, doctors in China reported this week.

Cough, fever and pneumonia went away faster, and the disease seemed less likely to turn severe in people who received hydroxychloroquine than in a comparison group not given the drug. The authors of the report said that the medication was promising, but that more research was needed to clarify how it might work in treating coronavirus disease and to determine the best way to use it.

“It’s going to send a ripple of excitement out through the treating community,” said Dr. William Schaffner, an infectious disease expert at Vanderbilt University.

The study was small and limited to patients who were mildly or moderately ill, not severe cases. Like many reports about the coronavirus, it was posted at medRxiv, an online server for medical articles, before undergoing peer review by other researchers.

But please note the date - it would be a very sick joke.

[Winstonm]

This is not encouraging.

Quote

A new report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention on Wednesday provides new evidence to bolster early reports that the transmission of the coronavirus — which has now infected over 887,000 people worldwide — can happen prior to symptoms. Published in the CDC’s Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report (MMWR), the study underscores the potential difficulty of containing a virus that may be spreading silently.

[FelicityR]

This is what I put in a previous post, Winston. Possibly, and this is only a theory, people who have travelled and had vaccines for other illnesses like dengue fever, malaria, yellow fever, etc. have some advantage of fighting this illness than people who haven't. The reason I say this is that I now know of one person (a friend) who has had coronavirus, but only very mild symptoms, after returning from Asia. He is over 60, not 100% healthy, but he has travelled the world extensively, especially in Asia.

Hydroxychloroquine is a malaria tablet. Whether Hydroxychloroquine would work wholesale is open to question, because malaria is neither a viral or bacterial disease: malaria is caused by a tiny parasite. Donald Trump previously hyped (hydroxy)chloroquine as a game-changer.

However, hydroxychloroquine is also used for the treatment of rheumatoid arthritis as a disease modifying drug, where it supresses the immune system. Having a strong immune system, not one that has been compromised by ill-health, old age, or supressed by medication, is essential to fight any bacterial or viral illness, including covid-19.

[pescetom]

Yesterday's statistics in Italy (could not access the forum): positive 80572 (+3%), dead 13155 (+6%), no longer infected 16857 (+7%). Intensive care 4035 (+0%). Fatality rate 14.0%.
More confirmation of a second and lower plateau for he positive rate, but the fatality rate continues to rise.

Debate in Italy yesterday focussed on under-reporting of Covid19 deaths.
Bergamo University and the local paper published a study counting 4500 deaths due to Covid19 instead of the 2050 indicated by the Health Ministry.
The Mayor of Urbino (a university city in the hills of Pesaro) said they usually had 20 deaths in March but this year 150, of which 30 ascribed to Covid19.
Deaths in homes for the elderly and deaths of people in their own homes (who have never been tested) are not being counted.
So we have under-reporting by factors of 2.2 and 4.3 respectively.
Say we choose 3, that would mean 40K real Covid19 deaths so far.
Assume a true mortality rate of say 2%, that would mean 2 million people infected so far (3% of population).
Just playing with numbers, but probably less so that the official statistics even in this relatively honest country.

[y66]

FelicityR, on 2020-April-02, 01:37, said:

However, hydroxychloroquine is also used for the treatment of rheumatoid arthritis as a disease modifying drug, where it supresses the immune system. Having a strong immune system, not one that has been compromised by ill-health, old age, or supressed by medication, is essential to fight any bacterial or viral illness, including covid-19.

I suspect you know well that some covid-19 fatalities are caused by immune systems that don't know when to turn themselves off and that some medical professionals recommend that "all patients with severe COVID-19 should be screened for hyperinflammation using laboratory trends (eg, increasing ferritin, decreasing platelet counts, or erythrocyte sedimentation rate) and the HScore11 (table) to identify the subgroup of patients for whom immunosuppression could improve mortality" per https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30628-0/fulltext

Edit: fixed link sorry

[FelicityR]

y66, on 2020-April-02, 09:07, said:

I suspect you know well that some covid-19 fatalities are caused by immune systems that don't know when to turn themselves off and that some medical professionals recommend that "all patients with severe COVID-19 should be screened for hyperinflammation.

Thank you for the link. (It does works if you cut and paste it into your browser in full) And, no, I didn't know about the hyperinflammation aspect.

This article I found interesting about Senegal

https://ewn.co.za/20...nt-is-promising

The last paragraph makes interesting reading: The European Medicine Agency warned on Wednesday that neither chloroquine nor hydroxychloroquine should be used to treat COVID-19 cases, except for clinical trials or in the event of a "national emergency."

Given the severity of the illness, the numbers that have already been tested positive, and the numbers that have died, I wonder what they constitute as a 'national emergency'?

[Winstonm]

FelicityR, on 2020-April-02, 01:37, said:

This is what I put in a previous post, Winston. Possibly, and this is only a theory, people who have travelled and had vaccines for other illnesses like dengue fever, malaria, yellow fever, etc. have some advantage of fighting this illness than people who haven't. The reason I say this is that I now know of one person (a friend) who has had coronavirus, but only very mild symptoms, after returning from Asia. He is over 60, not 100% healthy, but he has travelled the world extensively, especially in Asia.

Hydroxychloroquine is a malaria tablet. Whether Hydroxychloroquine would work wholesale is open to question, because malaria is neither a viral or bacterial disease: malaria is caused by a tiny parasite. Donald Trump previously hyped (hydroxy)chloroquine as a game-changer.

However, hydroxychloroquine is also used for the treatment of rheumatoid arthritis as a disease modifying drug, where it supresses the immune system. Having a strong immune system, not one that has been compromised by ill-health, old age, or supressed by medication, is essential to fight any bacterial or viral illness, including covid-19.

The information changes frequently. I am now seeing that early in the infection is when there is the highest viral shed, that asymptomatic and mildly symptomatic are making the spread nearly impossible to contain. It would appear that testing - as South Korea accomplished - is the best mechanism to fight this problem.

[y66]

FelicityR, on 2020-April-02, 09:46, said:

This article I found interesting about Senegal

https://ewn.co.za/20...nt-is-promising

The last paragraph makes interesting reading: The European Medicine Agency warned on Wednesday that neither chloroquine nor hydroxychloroquine should be used to treat COVID-19 cases, except for clinical trials or in the event of a "national emergency."

Given the severity of the illness, the numbers that have already been tested positive, and the numbers that have died, I wonder what they constitute as a 'national emergency'?

Good question for the FDA. From Alex Tabarrok at Marginal Revolution:

Quote

The KN95 mask is China’s version of the N95 mask. 3M, America’s largest manufacturer of N95 masks, said in January that the masks are equivalent. But the FDA is not allowing KN95s into the country.

Buzzfeed: The KN95 mask is a Chinese alternative to the scarce N95 mask, but the FDA refuses to allow it into the country.

…By law, masks, along with most medical devices, can’t be imported or sold in the United States without the Food and Drug Administration’s say-so. Last week, to ease the national shortfall of protective gear, the FDA issued an emergency authorization for non-N95 respirators that had been certified by five foreign countries as well as the European Union. It conspicuously left the KN95 masks out of the emergency authorization.

The omission was all the more startling because in late February the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said that KN95 masks were one of numerous “suitable alternatives” to N95 masks “when supplies are short.”

…Allowing the importation and use of KN95 could help to greatly alleviate the scarcity.

“The KN95 masks are far more readily available,” said Bob Tilton, who owns a New Jersey–based cosmetics packaging importer and earlier this month decided to use his familiarity with Chinese supply chains to bring in masks and other personal protective equipment to sell to hospitals. “The N95s are much harder to grab.”

Yet without the FDA’s seal of approval, importers are hesitant to order KN95 masks because they worry they’ll get held up at customs.

It’s not just the FDA that is to blame, however. America’s legal system is also to blame:

Many hospitals are refusing to accept them, even as free donations, because they fear legal liability should a health care worker get ill while using a nonpermitted device…Although some hospitals flat-out reject KN95 masks at any price on advice of their lawyers, people rounding up masks to give to hospitals have found that individual doctors or nurses will often accept the donations, given the dire need.

Consider that last bit of insanity. The ethical and common-law type rule is very simple: Do everything reasonable to protect your hospital workers. But what some feckless hospital administrators are actually doing is following “the law” even if it conflicts with the ethical rule.

New England Patriot's owner Robert Kraft gets it:

Quote

At 3:38 a.m. Wednesday morning, the New England Patriots’ team plane departed from an unusual locale: Shenzhen, China. On board the Boeing 767, in the cargo hold that used to be home to Tom Brady’s duffel bags, were 1.2 million N95 masks bound for the U.S.

Video and pictures of the event show workers in masks and full-body suits at Shenzhen Bao’an International Airport loading box after box of the scarce and valuable personal protective equipment onto a red, white and blue plane emblazoned with the Patriots logo and “6X CHAMPIONS.”

The plane was permitted to be on the ground in China for a maximum of three hours, people familiar with the matter said, and the crew was required to stay on the plane while a ground crew loaded the cargo. It took 2 hours and 57 minutes. On Thursday, that plane will land somewhere more familiar: Boston Logan International Airport.

The story of this remarkable delivery, based on documents and interviews with people involved in the operation, is a window into the frenzied scramble by states to acquire life-saving equipment needed to battle the coronavirus pandemic. The process involves not just tracking down goods, but also tapping intermediaries and calling in favors to navigate a dense global bureaucracy that the pandemic has virtually paralyzed.

As the country and the medical system have grappled with responding to the virus, one of the greatest pressure points has been the shortage of N95 masks, critical equipment to protect against its spread. Demand has significantly outpaced supply, putting health-care workers and patients at even greater risk.

Massachusetts’ quest to acquire these masks was a tense, weekslong saga that began with the state’s governor and winded through embassies, private partners and the U.S.’s most successful football franchise. After a layover in Alaska and an anxious process to win approval from Chinese officials, the plane was given permission to land in China to collect the masks.

“I’ve never seen so much red tape in so many ways and obstacles that we had to overcome,” said Robert Kraft, the Patriots’ owner. “In today’s world, those of us who are fortunate to make a difference have a significant responsibility to do so with all the assets we have available to us.”

The effort began with Massachusetts Gov. Charlie Baker, who was concerned about the state’s mask supply and, two weeks ago, believed he had struck a deal to acquire more than a million of them from a collection of Chinese manufacturers. But officials had to figure out how to get them shipped out of China at a time when unusual cargo shipments out of the country can be especially tricky.

“I just have to get them here,” he told a longtime friend.

That longtime friend was Jonathan Kraft, Robert Kraft’s son, who holds two jobs that became highly relevant to the proceedings. Jonathan Kraft is the chairman of the board at Massachusetts General Hospital, one of the country’s most renowned facilities. He’s also the Patriots’ president, and the team had something it thought might be of help: a giant airplane.

There were tough questions to resolve. Robert and Jonathan Kraft first had to check if the plane was ready and able to make such a lengthy journey on such short notice. There was also the fact that the team’s Boeing 767 is a passenger plane built to carry Bill Belichick and Tom Brady, not massive stores of cargo.

Then, most critically, they had to secure permission to land in China—a delicate feat during this global pandemic. Even if they received the proper permits, they were worried the pilots would be required by China to quarantine for 14 days before returning.

The primary issue was the simplest: getting the right to land the 767. Gov. Baker, the U.S. State Department, Robert Kraft and others sent letters to China’s consul general in New York requesting the special permits. The letters, dated March 24 to 30, ask for waivers to allow the humanitarian mission and state that no member of the crew would leave the aircraft.

By last Friday night, the crew had moved to Wilmington, Ohio, because the plane needed an avionics upgrade for the international trip. The mission received waivers from China to land and do so without quarantining—nobody would be on board besides the necessary flight crew—but they were told the crew still needed visas. So the entire group scrambled to a local pharmacy and took pictures for the application. The pictures were flown to New York to be taken to the Chinese consulate, and then flown back to Ohio. Huang Ping, China’s consul general in New York, proved to be a major ally in the effort to get the rush jobs done, including by opening the consulate over the weekend to get the visas processed in time, people familiar with the matter said.

Next, the plane headed to Alaska. The only breaks the crew took from then on were for mandatory rest and downtime. As a precaution, the crew included maintenance people and spare parts so they could solve any potential issues in China without people on the ground.

from Andrew Beaton at WSJ

[y66]

Carl T. Bergstrom @CT_Bergstrom Prof. Biology @UW said:

So much of the mistrust swirling around mask recommendations from WHO and other authorities seems to have arisen out of confusion between receiver protection (your mask protects you from others) and source control (your mask protects others from you).

Quote

A properly fitted N95 provides effective receiver protection, but fitting is very difficult and not easily achieved by members of the public without training and equipment. This thread provides further detail: https://twitter.com/...018922023440385

Quote

A basic surgical-type face covering provides effective source control. A study out this morning in @NatureMedicine of non-COVID coronaviruses provides good evidence that you are less likely to shed virus in aerosol/respiratory droplets when wearing a mask.

Quote

Given this and related studies it strikes me that there is a strong case for advocating use of surgical-type masks, even home-made masks, scarfs, other face coverings in public. None of this will necessarily protect you much—but it will protect others from you if you are sick.

Quote

My feeling is that given what we know now, we should recommend that people wear masks to reduce transmission when out in public. Of course this is not a substitute for staying home as much as possible, nor for keeping a 2m distance from others when out. But it could help.

Quote

Messaging should stress the pro-social (as opposed to self-protective nature) of mask wearing, given the risk of pre-symptomatic transmission. I'd imagine we would reach a tipping point where the stigma rapidly reverses from being against those wearing to those not wearing.

[Winstonm]

y66, on 2020-April-03, 09:29, said:

From what I am reading, research seems to be indicating that viral shed is most pronounced in the earliest stages of infection and up to 25% of infected are asymptomatic or nearly so, meaning it would make sense to compel masks in public as it is impossible to know who is carrying and who is not.