[Shugart23]

Under the new ACBL rules, will I be allowed to open 2H (or 2S) showing 5+ cards with an undisclosed 4+ side suit ? When we have a 5332 shape, we open 1NT (12-15 HCP) and usually pass with less than 12 HCP..When we open 1H or 1S we are promising either exactly 4 cards in the suit or 6+ cards in the suit (with a few rare exceptions). Thus, when we open 2H (or 2S), there could be an inference that opener almost always has a 4 card suit as well as the 5 card Major.....I am just thinking at this point of tweaking a few of our bids where Responder would relay over 2H (or 2S) open to ask where the other suit is.

[hrothgar]

Shugart23, on 2018-June-25, 06:58, said:

Under the new ACBL rules, will I be allowed to open 2H (or 2S) showing 5+ cards with an undisclosed 4+ side suit ? When we have a 5332 shape, we open 1NT (12-15 HCP) and usually pass with less than 12 HCP..When we open 1H or 1S we are promising either exactly 4 cards in the suit or 6+ cards in the suit (with a few rare exceptions). Thus, when we open 2H (or 2S), there could be an inference that opener almost always has a 4 card suit as well as the 5 card Major.....I am just thinking at this point of tweaking a few of our bids where Responder would relay over 2H (or 2S) open to ask where the other suit is.

Yes

[Shugart23]

hrothgar, on 2018-June-25, 08:00, said:

Yes

thanks...am I correct in thinking that in the 'old' days, this was not allowed?

[hrothgar]

Shugart23, on 2018-June-25, 08:12, said:

thanks...am I correct in thinking that in the 'old' days, this was not allowed?

Back during the bad times there was enormous confusion about this entire topic.


The critical data point to be aware of is item "i" under the definition of "natural which reads

A call is still Natural if it also shows distribution in another suit.

[steve2005]

hrothgar, on 2018-June-25, 08:21, said:

A call is still Natural if it also shows distribution in another suit.

This is explicitly the new rule.
It was ridiculous to not apply in some situations (but was on in some)
Everyone knows when you open 1C you might have 4 or even 5 spades. Nobody would suggest your 1C bid was artificial.
Yet it seemed you couldn't open a preempt with 5D and 4H. It is certainly legal to open 2D on 5D. You are allowed to open 2D on hands that have 5H and 4D. Why can't you open only on hands with 5D and 4H. It was ridiculous and no more.

[hrothgar]

steve2005, on 2018-June-25, 15:44, said:

This is explicitly the new rule.
It was ridiculous to not apply in some situations (but was on in some)
Everyone knows when you open 1C you might have 4 or even 5 spades. Nobody would suggest your 1C bid was artificial.
Yet it seemed you couldn't open a preempt with 5D and 4H. It is certainly legal to open 2D on 5D. You are allowed to open 2D on hands that have 5H and 4D. Why can't you open only on hands with 5D and 4H. It was ridiculous and no more.

From my perspective, the truly inane case was whether a 2♠ preempt that also promises 4+ cards in a minor was conventional under the current rules.

I used to collect conflicting written interpretations from the powers that be in Horn Lake.

[barmar]

steve2005, on 2018-June-25, 15:44, said:

Everyone knows when you open 1C you might have 4 or even 5 spades. Nobody would suggest your 1C bid was artificial.

There's a significant difference between "might have" and "shows".