[MrAce]

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PD is expert, opponents are world class, IMPs

System notes: 1 NT = forcing NT 4-14 hcp can have fit. 2m by pd would be GF (unless simple suit rebid) and 5+ cards. Your X here will be penalty with this partner.

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2♦ by pd was F1 (9+) natural. Opponents are expert/worldclass. (please say so if you would not have opened the S hand)

I got both of those wrong.

[Mkgnao]

1. Pass
2. 3♣

[eagles123]

1 - edited to pass!!
2 - pass

[MrAce]

eagles123, on 2018-April-08, 05:03, said:

1 - X
2 - pass

X will be penalty with this pd. I just added that so..you may wanna change your #1.

[Dinarius]

1. 3♦️(competitive, not forcing, and bidding on the vulnerability)
2. Pass

[gszes]

Mkgnao, on 2018-April-08, 04:54, said:

1. Pass
2. 3♣

1. PASS yes yes this LOOKS so much better than the usual dreck we open but is it really the hand u want to encourage partner with? Game seems far off and should be impossible if partner cannot act over 2s. If we want to get froggy and bid 4d (if partner balances with x) that should be sufficient. If p balances with 3d (which would severely limit their HCP power) I think pass is sufficient switch my hand around to xx AKQxx Axxx xx and a 4d raise even over 3d is warranted.

2. 3c NOW is the time to show these extra values. I do not want partner to think we have some kind of dia support (pass) and we also have a tremendous hand for 3n and a relatively easy path to getting there if partner wishes to explore further.

[nullve]

If I'm Fred Flintstone:

1. 3♦
2. 3♣

[MrAce]

nullve, on 2018-April-08, 17:12, said:

If I'm Fred Flintstone:

1. 3♦
2. 3♣

[ahydra]

Probably best to pass on 1 in case partner gets excited (though I hate the agreements - still, even if X was T/O you need some agreement as to whether you X with all extra-value, say 17+ hands, making new suit bids "I don't have a pile of rubbish but it's not a huge hand" or whether you can X then pull ELC-style).

On 2 seems clear to bid 3C, bid what you've got, which is a minimum with a bucketload of clubs. I'm happy to open this (though not without the 7th club).

ahydra

[rmnka447]

1. Pass

Whose hand is it? I don't think you can make a call not knowing. So, pass so with the balance of points, partner can make a move.

2. 3 ♣

Shows length and doesn't promise much else. Like others have said, bid what you've got.

[hrothgar]

gszes, on 2018-April-08, 13:33, said:

1. PASS yes yes this LOOKS so much better than the usual dreck we open but is it really the hand u want to encourage partner with? Game seems far off and should be impossible if partner cannot act over 2s. If we want to get froggy and bid 4d (if partner balances with x) that should be sufficient. If p balances with 3d (which would severely limit their HCP power) I think pass is sufficient switch my hand around to xx AKQxx Axxx xx and a 4d raise even over 3d is warranted.

2. 3c NOW is the time to show these extra values. I do not want partner to think we have some kind of dia support (pass) and we also have a tremendous hand for 3n and a relatively easy path to getting there if partner wishes to explore further.

What he said

[foobar]

hrothgar, on 2018-April-09, 15:26, said:

What he said

+1

[MrAce]

Fred Flintstone got them all correct. GJ Nullve.
And most of you did much better than I did.

On hand #1 I asked to worldclass players. Pass was out of question for all of them. Their logic was similar to each other "You know they have a ♠ fit and if you pass there is a good chance that it may go all pass. You have to bid 3♦"
One of them added "Partscore competitions at IMPS or team games is almost as important as it is at MP. Only difference is, you do not try to get -100 instead of -110 or -140 as you do at MP. However, you can not afford to pass when it is very likely that both sides make their partscore."
I passed 2♠ and that was bad score.

As it turns out pd held something like ;

xxx x JTxxx Axxx (if i remember correctly) And except all but one had no idea about the pd's hand when they advocated 3♦ call.

On hand #2 I passed again, and I admit i was not happy with my pass at all. It went

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Pd was Richard Pavlicek. Not only I passed 2♠ but my 4♣ was also another awful bid imo. The way we open, I can not blame him passing 4♣, even with his 13 hcp vs opener. My 2 aces were very valuable. Perhaps I shd have chosen the calls I did, had I held softer values.

Thanks to all for replies

[rmnka447]

MrAce, on 2018-April-09, 17:50, said:

Fred Flintstone got them all correct. GJ Nullve.
And most of you did much better than I did.

On hand #1 I asked to worldclass players. Pass was out of question for all of them. Their logic was similar to each other "You know they have a ♠ fit and if you pass there is a good chance that it may go all pass. You have to bid 3♦"
One of them added "Partscore competitions at IMPS or team games is almost as important as it is at MP. Only difference is, you do not try to get -100 instead of -110 or -140 as you do at MP. However, you can not afford to pass when it is very likely that both sides make their partscore."
I passed 2♠ and that was bad score.

As it turns out pd held something like ;

xxx x JTxxx Axxx (if i remember correctly) And except all but one had no idea about the pd's hand when they advocated 3♦ call.

On hand #2 I passed again, and I admit i was not happy with my pass at all. It went

---

Pd was Richard Pavlicek. Not only I passed 2♠ but my 4♣ was also another awful bid imo. The way we open, I can not blame him passing 4♣, even with his 13 hcp vs opener. My 2 aces were very valuable. Perhaps I shd have chosen the calls I did, had I held softer values.

Thanks to all for replies

Thanks for the follow up because it's interesting to hear the opinions of world class players. Our team is currently adjusting to now consistently playing against top level players and trying to figure out how to change our thinking. So any information that sheds light on their approach is useful. My sense is that there is a level of aggressiveness that we never saw playing against really good solid players a level down.

[Dinarius]

Glad I got 3♦ right. Still feels right. No wasted values in Opps suit, 6 loser hand, lots of playing strength, favourable vulnerability. I figure 3♦double minus one at the very worst. If 3♦ is non-forcing, as I believe it is (a reopening Double would be the forcing bid here the way I play)then I can bid it.

I still prefer Pass on number 2. Doesn't partner have to think, "What would opener's rebid have been? It has to have been NT or ♣, surely?"

South's Pass screams, minimum opening and Clubs. Over to you North.

D.

[rhm]

rmnka447, on 2018-April-09, 15:02, said:

2. 3 ♣

Shows length and doesn't promise much else. Like others have said, bid what you've got.

Nicely said, but I wonder what you do when you have the same distribution but an ace more.
I would consider 3♣ forcing here at IMPs.

With standard agreements I think you have to pass both hands.
Italians tend to double with all good hands in competition and can bid 3♣ showing a limited hand.

Rainer Herrmann

[rhm]

MrAce, on 2018-April-09, 17:50, said:

Fred Flintstone got them all correct. GJ Nullve.
And most of you did much better than I did.

On hand #1 I asked to worldclass players. Pass was out of question for all of them. Their logic was similar to each other "You know they have a ♠ fit and if you pass there is a good chance that it may go all pass. You have to bid 3♦"
One of them added "Partscore competitions at IMPS or team games is almost as important as it is at MP. Only difference is, you do not try to get -100 instead of -110 or -140 as you do at MP. However, you can not afford to pass when it is very likely that both sides make their partscore."
I passed 2♠ and that was bad score.

As it turns out pd held something like ;

xxx x JTxxx Axxx (if i remember correctly) And except all but one had no idea about the pd's hand when they advocated 3♦ call.

On hand #2 I passed again, and I admit i was not happy with my pass at all. It went

---

Pd was Richard Pavlicek. Not only I passed 2♠ but my 4♣ was also another awful bid imo. The way we open, I can not blame him passing 4♣, even with his 13 hcp vs opener. My 2 aces were very valuable. Perhaps I shd have chosen the calls I did, had I held softer values.

Thanks to all for replies

I think the problem was your 4♣ bid, not your pass.
Over 3♥ you should jump to 5♣ precisely because your values are not soft. This gives a precise description about your hand in light of your previous pass and North could have bid 6♣ if he held a singleton spade
(your partner denied a spade stopper)

Rainer Herrmann

[Dinarius]

rhm, on 2018-April-10, 04:10, said:

I think the problem was your 4♣ bid, not your pass.
Over 3♥ you should jump to 5♣ precisely because your values are not soft. This gives a precise description about your hand in light of your previous pass and North could have bid 6♣ if he held a singleton spade
(your partner denied a spade stopper)

Rainer Herrmann

I agree.

One of the fundamental points at play here is that North knows
that he has opening values opposite opening values. South doesn't, and can't, know this; at least not yet.

That is why I believe that it's North's move, so to speak, not South's, and why Pass is South's best bid.

I'm assuming that N/S are playing strong NT, so Pass by South says; "I'm minimum, and my rebid was either Clubs or 12-14 NT or, possibly though unlikely, 1♠" It's surely the most descriptive bid? North MUST compete at any form of scoring opposite South's Pass.

At MPs, I would then bid 2♠ with North's hand. South would retreat to 3♣ and the picture is complete for North to bid 5♣, no?

D.