[Antrax]

None vul, IMPs.

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Partner opens 3♦ (partner is GIB, so preempt style is fairly disciplined) in first seat, pass to you. Any bid?
I passed, LHO bids 3NT back to you. Now what?

[the hog]

Pass and pass.

[mgoetze]

Keep passing.

[Cthulhu D]

Pass with some relief, and hope it goes off on a bad break.

[Antrax]

The first pass is clear I think - mostly because partner might bid again. If partner were barred for the rest of the auction, would 4♠ have been right?

I can't figure out why you shouldn't double 3NT. You're looking at 10 HCP to go with partner's 6+, so it's not like they're going to hit you a 30 combined. Breaks are bad for the pointed suits, so it looks if you just go passive declarer should have a hard time finding a ninth trick, no?

On the actual hand

Spoiler

declarer earned +550 because GIB gave it the club suit on the lead (led the ♣T from its ♣Txx into dummy's ♣QJ98x).

[the hog]

Antrax, on 2014-October-23, 22:09, said:

The first pass is clear I think - mostly because partner might bid again. If partner were barred for the rest of the auction, would 4♠ have been right?

I can't figure out why you shouldn't double 3NT. You're looking at 10 HCP to go with partner's 6+, so it's not like they're going to hit you a 30 combined. Breaks are bad for the pointed suits, so it looks if you just go passive declarer should have a hard time finding a ninth trick, no?

On the actual hand

Spoiler

declarer earned +550 because GIB gave it the club suit on the lead (led the ♣T from its ♣Txx into dummy's ♣QJ98x).

I don't understand this post. Partner would, of course, not bid again if you bid 4S.
No, I am not going to double. It would not even occur to me.

[the_clown]

Antrax, on 2014-October-23, 22:09, said:

The first pass is clear I think - mostly because partner might bid again. If partner were barred for the rest of the auction, would 4♠ have been right?

I can't figure out why you shouldn't double 3NT. You're looking at 10 HCP to go with partner's 6+, so it's not like they're going to hit you a 30 combined. Breaks are bad for the pointed suits, so it looks if you just go passive declarer should have a hard time finding a ninth trick, no?

On the actual hand

Spoiler

declarer earned +550 because GIB gave it the club suit on the lead (led the ♣T from its ♣Txx into dummy's ♣QJ98x).

Its nice that we have HCP but I dont see many tricks for our side (except for ♥A). Strong hand is behind us so finesses will probably work for them. And partner has no idea what to lead.

[MrAce]

Antrax, on 2014-October-23, 22:09, said:

I can't figure out why you shouldn't double 3NT. You're looking at 10 HCP to go with partner's 6+, so it's not like they're going to hit you a 30 combined. Breaks are bad for the pointed suits, so it looks if you just go passive declarer should have a hard time finding a ninth trick, no?

[Antrax]

Hey, I know just enough to think myself into stupid plays
For serious I tried visualizing and all that and decided declarer will score 5 clubs off the top before losing the lead a second time and us cashing a lot of pointed suit cards.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

most would play X of 3NT as lead directing, eiter demanding a diamond lead
or forbidding a diamond lead, take your pick.
We play it as demand, and one thing is for sure ... I dont want to have a
diamond lead.
Regarding 4S: You basically lack communication, on average you will be -2/-3,
depending how much you find out side diamonds with p.
3NT can go down, but you have a lot of honors out side diamonds, i.e. if declarer
has to locate specific honors, he will guess right, the only question is, how often can
he travel to dummy.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[PhilKing]

I would jump to 4♠ immediately. I don't expect this to receive overwhelming support, but I will wait to be flamed before justifying my stance.

[kuhchung]

Jump to 4S? We have some pretty adequate defense, I'd be pretty happy to defend 4H, and we're probably going to catch a stiff spade and just go for a number!

Bidding 4S really shows a lack of bridge understanding. Perhaps you should go back to playing with the novices.

Spoiler

i really wanted to see the reason

[Cthulhu D]

PhilKing, on 2014-October-28, 16:50, said:

I would jump to 4♠ immediately. I don't expect this to receive overwhelming support, but I will wait to be flamed before justifying my stance.

OK I was going to start a small fire but kuhchung has that covered, so what's the logic?

[PhilKing]

kuhchung, on 2014-October-28, 17:26, said:

Jump to 4S? We have some pretty adequate defense, I'd be pretty happy to defend 4H, and we're probably going to catch a stiff spade and just go for a number!

Bidding 4S really shows a lack of bridge understanding. Perhaps you should go back to playing with the novices.

Spoiler

i really wanted to see the reason

Nice spoiler.

---

Muller/De Wijs were North South versus the Madsen brothers. 4♠ went two down. 4♥ would possibly go 5 down.

The auction looks crazy but it gave East an insoluble problem. The "cold" 3NT was reached in the other room. However, since you don't rate to make 3♣, you may as well jump to 4♥ and give them a real headache (it's not as if you can get to 3♥).

The set-up in the original hand in this thread is not identical, but some of the principles can be applied. On the original hand it's really difficult for them to nail us in 4♠ - after all double would usually be for take-out. If we catch them with a hand that would have overcalled 3NT (which would presumably make quite a decent amount of the time), they are more or less stuck, and if they stick out their neck with a 5♣ overcall, or gulp, 5♥ we will be delighted.

Randoms probably can double you in 4M, but more cultured players usually can't, so you should choose your opponents carefully when trying this sort of thing. And if you play against the Dutch, remember to play double as strong balanced here.

[kuhchung]

It isn't enough that you Europeans preempt crazy, you have to advance crazy too?

Spoiler

thanks, pretty interesting