[1eyedjack]

Do you get to see inverted minor rebids much?

Two particular scenarios I have in mind:

(uncontested)

1C-1N-2C/3C inverted

and

1D-1N-2C/3C inverted

The case is less robust for

1D-1N-2D/3D inverted

but it may still have some legs even there

[mikestar13]

I have never seen or heard of this being played. I assume they would apply only to 1m-1NT-2m/3m sequences, as only after a 1NT response can opener be sure there is no game on power. Inverted rebids in 1m-1M-3m sequences are unplayable. 2m showing extras saves a fair amount of space, but what do you do to handle minimum hands with shapes like 5-4-3-1 with 5m? SAYC or 2/1 players which can usually get away with rebidding 2m on these hands.

[gordontd]

I play this with one partner, only after 1C-1NT, because we play that it promises four clubs and so you are pretty safe getting to the three level with a nine-card fit. After a 1D opener you don't have the same certainty about either minor.

[1eyedjack]

gordontd, on 2014-August-25, 01:32, said:

After a 1D opener you don't have the same certainty about either minor.

After 1D-1N, if you were planning to rebid a standard 2C then you are assured of a minor suit fit. It is true that you may not (yet) know which minor, but that doesn't matter. Partner will pass or convert to 3D as appropriate over a weak 3C.

You are correct that a *9* card fit is not guaranteed after 1D-1N. But then, with an 8 card fit are you going to sell out to their 2M? If not, would you not rather put them to the last guess straight away? They don't know that you are only in an 8 card fit (if such is the case). If 3m sounds too high, then passing 1N may be the better option.

Likewise, after 1C-1N (promising 4+ Clubs), what are your plans as opener with a 4 card Club suit? Pass 1N? Could well be right. But if you were contemplating retreating to a known 8 card Club fit, I feel that you would want to do it at the 3 level. Again 9 card fit is not a certainty, but it may be there, the opponents are likewise in the dark, and they are the ones left guessing. Partner has no problems, he just passes.

1D-1N-2D/3D inverted is harder to justify. Here there may genuinely be no fit. Responder could be 3-3-1-6. And yet I suggest that if opener has a hand that wishes to retreat from 1N to 2D then the likelihood of a D misfit is sufficiently remote that the benefits of pre-emption MAY outweigh that risk. I am not sure about that - just run it up the flagpole.

I expect this is all otiose if playing TWalsh, which is an improvement so perhaps pointless talking about a known inferior starting set of responses.