[alphred]

North is dealer and East-West are vulnerable. We play Standard American.

West: Spades J 7 5
Hearts A K 5 4 2
Diamonds A 10 6 2
Clubs A

East: Spades A Q 10
Hearts 7
Diamonds Q 7 5 4 3
Clubs J 10 7 4

After three passes East can begin. The opponents are silent.

[ahydra]

If there are three passes then it is West's turn.

1H-1NT
2D-2S (impossible spade: shows a very good diamond raise in the context of 1NT)
3C (should really be a 3-card suit, but we need to make some generic forward going move to discover whether there is a spade stop)-3NT

ahydra

[mycroft]

---

[mikeh]

ahydra, on 2013-October-11, 07:04, said:

If there are three passes then it is West's turn.

1H-1NT
2D-2S (impossible spade: shows a very good diamond raise in the context of 1NT)
3C (should really be a 3-card suit, but we need to make some generic forward going move to discover whether there is a spade stop)-3NT

ahydra

If I were responder, I would place opener with 1=5=4=3 or 0=5=4=4 or 0=5=5=3, and I wouldn't take it as a probe for 3N at all.

I'd think that opener was actively seeking a high-level diamond contract. Say I held xxx Qx KQxxx Kxx: I would now be thinking of slam in diamonds, when we can see that we belong in 3N.

It is important, when choosing a call for opener after the 2♠ bid to remember that responder will interpret the bid without seeing our hand. We 'know' that we meant 3♣ as a probe for 3N, but responder should look at, say, xxx Qx KQxxx Kxx and picture something like x AKxxx AJxx Axx.

If you disagree, please tell me how you'd bid this hand as opener? To me, 1♥ then 2♦ then 3♣ seems clear.

I agree with the 2♠ choice, btw. I see the hand as minimum for the call, but the 5th trump tips the scales.

As West, I'd probably bid 2N myself. We can't have everything and no other call suits. I'd have to be unlucky to find that the opps can run spades on this auction...even xx over there offers a decent chance. This would, I assume, fetch 3N, which is an ok spot.

[gszes]

p p p

2/1

1h normal
1n normal forcing
2d normal 3+ normal
2N yes we have a dia fit but majors NT minors has us looking for NT
----before we worry about diamonds.
3N

sayc

1h normal
1n normal
2d
2N our 5th dia looks a lot better after p bids 2d
3n.

similar sequences with slightly different meanings note that if
we had a small club instead of the A we could bid 3s over 2n
to let p know about our club suit "worry" . That bid makes no
sense here.

We could use 2s as some form of impossible 2s but that bid is
better used when we have an unstopped suit for NT (our most
likely game by far).

[ahydra]

mikeh, on 2013-October-11, 10:23, said:

If I were responder, I would place opener with 1=5=4=3 or 0=5=4=4 or 0=5=5=3, and I wouldn't take it as a probe for 3N at all.

I'd think that opener was actively seeking a high-level diamond contract. Say I held xxx Qx KQxxx Kxx: I would now be thinking of slam in diamonds, when we can see that we belong in 3N.

It is important, when choosing a call for opener after the 2♠ bid to remember that responder will interpret the bid without seeing our hand. We 'know' that we meant 3♣ as a probe for 3N, but responder should look at, say, xxx Qx KQxxx Kxx and picture something like x AKxxx AJxx Axx.

If you disagree, please tell me how you'd bid this hand as opener? To me, 1♥ then 2♦ then 3♣ seems clear.

I agree with the 2♠ choice, btw. I see the hand as minimum for the call, but the 5th trump tips the scales.

As West, I'd probably bid 2N myself. We can't have everything and no other call suits. I'd have to be unlucky to find that the opps can run spades on this auction...even xx over there offers a decent chance. This would, I assume, fetch 3N, which is an ok spot.

OP stated SAYC - so the East hand is surely a MAX for 2S, not a MIN, given that 1NT limits his hand to 9 HCPs. In a similar vein I would bid 2D, not 1NT, with your given hand.

Your point is still valid though - you should really have a 1543 or better shape for 3C. The problem is, xx opposite Jxx is most definitely not a stop We really do need a spade stop for 3NT here - even if we fake it with 2NT, opps are probably still leading one on this auction - and the only way we have to "ask" for a stop is 3C.

Unless, that is, you take up gszes' idea of bidding 2NT over 2D as responder, which I think is rather neat - showing the good diamond raise together with the spade (and club) stop.

ahydra

[hrothgar]

1N - 3N...

[hrothgar]

1N - 3N...

[gnasher]

Mike's auction (1♥-1♠;2♦-2♠;2NT-3NT) seems clear to me. If it's wrong to emphasise either of the black suits, it's right to show a bit in each with 2NT.

[CSGibson]

I would probably bid it as 1♥-1N, 2♦-2♠, 3N. I'm not worried about spades, because lefty had a chance to overcall them, and righty had a chance to double 2♠, I want to force to game, and I don't want to make partner worry about a club stopper in case his hand is something like Qxx Qx KQxxx xxx. In general I play jumps to 3N as 15-17 ish in auctions like this, which informs my decision to bid 3N instead of 2, but I don't have any real objections to 2N.

[nigel_k]

1. 1♥ opening is obvious
2. 1NT response is best. You are strong enough to bid 2♦ as a passed hand but you have a weak suit and 1NT will very often be the best contract.
3. Opener should rebid 2♦. A jump to 3♦ is game forcing and needs a much better hand, 18 HCP minimum with this shape
4. Other people have correctly suggested 2♠ but let's say you haven't discussed that and so just raise to 3♦. It would be very wrong to pass 2♦ since opener can have a very good hand. It's unlikely that 3♦ will fail unless opponent can make something.
5. Opener's third bid is the most difficult one. The choices are 3NT and 3♠. 3NT could be very poor if partner has nothing much in clubs. 3♠ describes the shape but is somewhat misleading as partner will not expect the singleton to be an honour so may go past 3NT when that is best. I would choose 3♠ probably.
6. Responder can then bid 5♦. J10xx is not enough of a stopper opposite opener's singleton and you have extra values and an extra trump that more than justify bidding game if partner is interested.

Full auction: 1♥-1NT-2♦-3♦-3♠-5♦.

[ggwhiz]

1♥ - 1nt
2♦ - 3♦
3♠ - 3nt

In our style the opener has shown 3-5-4-1 shape (patterning out) which you only do with the 16-18 point range which gives responder enough stuff to bid 3nt.

As you can see their are many styles that will handle the hand just as well and picking any of them will take some useful partnership discussion.

[Zelandakh]

1♥ - 1NT; 2♦ - 2♠; 2NT - 3NT looks obvious to me too.