[alphred]

Hi all
We are all vulnerable. Patner is dealer and opens with 1H. RHO passes.

I have Spades K 7 6 4
Hearts -
Diamonds J 10 6 3 2
Clubs 9 8 4 2

What shall I do?
thx all
Alphred

[ahydra]

Pass.

ahydra

[rmnka447]

Pass. A simple rule for misfits is to get out of the auction as quickly as you can.

Your hand is a marginal response hand at best, so passing isn't likely to make you miss any game.

1 ♥ may not be a great contract, but bidding might well prompt partner to bid 2 ♥ which would be worse.

[ArtK78]

You don't know it is a misfit yet. All you know is that you don't have a fit for hearts.

I would bid 1♠, intending to pass partner's next call unless he surprises me.

Sure, there is some risk in bidding. But for all you know, there might be a game on these cards if partner has a strong 2-suited hand.

[Zelandakh]

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ATB. I am not saying it is right to bid, just that we do not yet know if this hand is a misfit or a perfect fit.

[Cyberyeti]

You're in a gambling situation here, are you going to enjoy playing 1♥ opposite AQJx, Axxxx, KQx, x where 4♠ is pretty good, or are you going to enjoy playing 3♥ opposite x, AJ9xxxx, AK, Axx where 1♥ was pretty good.

I always bid 1♠ on this type of hand, but it's a matter of taste.

I play 4 card majors, but will only be 4 if 44(32) or 3433 15-bad 19, so is usually 5, and if it's the balanced hand I will get to play in spades if we have a 4-4 fit and 2♦ if we don't. I have the advantage in my system that partner will never bid 2N over 1♠ with a balanced hand.

[ggwhiz]

I always bid 1♠ on these too and get buried when pard jumps in hearts but usually survive everything else including getting to making games.

One thing that's important is to have an escape hatch should pard bid 2nt next. ie. For us 3♦ (or anything else) is to play with the exception that all game force hands must go through a 3♣ checkback bid and that limits the disasters somewhat.

[aguahombre]

rmnka447, on 2013-September-18, 06:37, said:

Pass. A simple rule for misfits is to get out of the auction as quickly as you can.

We misfits need rules.

[TylerE]

1♠ for me. 1N Forcing also has a certain devious appeal....especially if opponents are balance happy and end up bidding 2♠.

[mikeh]

The OP raises a fairly common issue, to which the vast majority of people who play bridge have no clear answer, because their methods and agreements, with partner, aren't well developed.

I would guess, and it is a guess, to respond 1♠ because a lot of good things could happen. A lot of bad things could happen as well, but that's why it is a guess.

Good things include:

Partner has 4 spades! Even tho he may get us too high in spades, our result in spades rates to be several tricks better than in 1♥

Partner rebids a minor. I'd pass 2♣ and I'd also pass a (100%) forcing 3♣. I can't remember the last time I advocated passing a forcing bid, but I would here. I wouldn't pass a forcing 3♦, tho...that 5th diamond makes a world of difference

Neutral things: 1N and 2N. I'd pass both, and expect that the average result wouldn't be much different from passing 1♥

The bad things are pretty much limited to partner rebidding any number of hearts. Tant pis.


Now, in my partnerships I have agreements that make bidding somewhat more attractive. This sort of agreement is common amongst experienced players with experienced partners.

The main area in which these help is when partner rebids in notrump.

Over 1N, I play that 2♣ is a puppet to 2♦, usually artificial and the start of showing an invitational hand of some kind. However, while it is 'usually' the start, it can and would here be the end of a signoff in 2♦. 2♦ may not be great but the odds are that if partner rebids 1N, 2♦ will prove a better contract than either 1♥ or 1N.

In a similar vein, many of us have the ability to get partner to bid 3♦ over 2N. Both Wolff relay and my preferred method of transfers use 3♣ to force 3♦, which we would then pass.

[Lord Molyb]

Quote

I'd also pass a (100%) forcing 3♣

slightly worried if I respond 1♠ and partner makes a jump shift to 3♣ as he could have a hand too strong to bid 4♥ right away such as
♠ AQx ♥AKJT9xx ♦x ♣KQx where 4♥ isn't terrible (requires 3-3 spades or onside ♣A or doubleton ♥Q) but we might pass 3♣.

but I do bid 1♠ as well even though I prefer to be non-vulnerable.

[the hog]

I would pass, because if you bid 1S a lot of bad things could happen such as jumps in Hs. I think this is clear by the way.

[gszes]

there are only a tiny % of hands where we will make game after p opens
1h. There are a fair number more where our final contract will be better than
1h (if we were to bid 1s). There are just way too many ways things can get
worse if we bid now.Risk vs reward would seem to indicate

Pass

I echo this sentiment since my spade suit is nothing special and p may feel
compelled to raise with 3 spades probably making things worse. Change
my distribution to 5044 and I can see a 1s bid.

[ahydra]

Zelandakh, on 2013-September-18, 06:58, said:

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ATB. I am not saying it is right to bid, just that we do not yet know if this hand is a misfit or a perfect fit.

Clearly North, for not opening the multi-way 2C where one of the options is a strong 3-suiter.

On a more serious note, what are the odds of that hand compared to something like Axx A10xxxx KQ xx? Or worse, partner has a nice-ish 15, perhaps with the SQ or something so he calls 3H. Ugh.

ahydra

[Cyberyeti]

ahydra, on 2013-September-19, 05:55, said:

Clearly North, for not opening the multi-way 2C where one of the options is a strong 3-suiter.

On a more serious note, what are the odds of that hand compared to something like Axx A10xxxx KQ xx? Or worse, partner has a nice-ish 15, perhaps with the SQ or something so he calls 3H. Ugh.

ahydra

Also depends slightly on style.

What do you bid with 6♥/4m over 1♠ ?
Do you freely raise to 2♠ on 3 ?
Can you sign off in 2♦ over a 1N rebid ?

But basically you're golden as long as partner doesn't bid more hearts.

[ArtK78]

ahydra, on 2013-September-19, 05:55, said:

Clearly North, for not opening the multi-way 2C where one of the options is a strong 3-suiter.

On a more serious note, what are the odds of that hand compared to something like Axx A10xxxx KQ xx? Or worse, partner has a nice-ish 15, perhaps with the SQ or something so he calls 3H. Ugh.

ahydra

Last I checked, responding 1♠ does not commit the partnership to the 4 level. So it is not a question of odds per se.

And, in my opinion, 3♥ is an overbid (an over rebid?) on the example that you provided.

As I said in my prior post, bidding over 1♥ has its risks, but, in my opinion, the benefits exceed the risks.

[Fluffy]

When I bid with this kind of crap I always switch 1♥ for 2 o 3, probably a murphy's law example.

[the_clown]

I would never pass that hand, 1N or 1♠ are both fine.

[PhilG007]

the_clown, on 2013-September-20, 05:11, said:

I would never pass that hand, 1N or 1♠ are both fine.

Then I would not want to be your partner. Responding on 4 pts
with a void in partners suit is what kamikaze bridge players do.

[aguahombre]

Whom you choose as a partner is a valid choice. The pro's and cons of responding are being addressed, your partnership picks are not. According to the title, here...this time you are posting in the correct forum