[gwnn]

1C-p-1S-?

1NT would be natural, 16-18 or thereabouts. 1C is better minor, but please comment on whether this makes a big difference w.r.t. your agreements.

Clarification: if you select on 3433 you are saying that with some 3433's you would double (e.g. maybe you would x on most 1444 11-counts but you require at least 15 points and no stop to double with 3433). I didn't put in 54/45 hands for simplicity and because I forgot. Too bad.

[cherdano]

Looks I am the only one doubling with 2344 so far. I would hate to pass with xx AKx AKQx xxxx. Is anyone really going to pass this? Bid 1NT?

[awm]

4-4 in the reds seems obvious with opening points. With 4-3 I will still double if I have a bit stronger hand like 14+.

[JLOGIC]

I recently had a thought while doubling on a defensivey 3433 15 count that it was wrong since I would also double with a 5-5 8 count so it covers too much ground. My partner jumped to 3H and we got to a game.

Anyways, I think the 4 trip hands are overrated in this kind of auction, it's not the same as 1x X where it's awesome. But it's still probably worthwhile. Part of the problem is even when you are on for 3N you often won't get there since partner isn't just gonna 2N on some 10 or 11 count.

[JLOGIC]

Also should mention I overcall very light which makes it less necessary to X to compete for a partscore. The sounder you overcall the better Xing is probably.

Dunno why I'm giving all the arguments for not doing something that I always do heh.

[gwnn]

4 trip hand? is that 4441?

[P_Marlowe]

With 44 in the unbid suit, I will make the X most of the time.

I am sure, this helps brilliant declarers, but until I play regular against those, I go with the X,
fighting for the part score as deerly as I can.

Colors do matter, honor distribution as well.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[JLOGIC]

 gwnn, on 2013-May-02, 01:35, said:

4 trip hand? is that 4441?

4 triple 3 aka 4333 aka 4 trip over here sometimes. 4441 is often known as "4 by 1" lol.

[WellSpyder]

 JLOGIC, on 2013-May-02, 05:09, said:

4441 is often known as "4 by 1" lol.

Why not trip 4, I wonder?

[gnasher]

I've never heard a 4333 shape described as "awesome" before.

[gwnn]

Gnasher you wrote in a different thread that you just play this x as takeout of spades, is that true? So specifically 4441 is, I guess, not an option normally? But 2434 is fine even without particular extras?

[gnasher]

 gwnn, on 2013-May-02, 05:31, said:

Gnasher you wrote in a different thread that you just play this x as takeout of spades, is that true? So specifically 4441 is, I guess, not an option normally? But 2434 is fine even without particular extras?

No, I said that when the 1♣ opening is 2+ I play it as takeout of spades. Against a 3+ club I think it should be takeout of spades and clubs.

[Phil]

3 cards in the unbid suits is my initial criteria. Even with 4trip if I'm stacked in the reds, double looks fine: xxx AKxx AKx xxx?

[aguahombre]

I think if the "2+" is just the possibility opener has 4=4=3=2 (the treatment now deemed natural over here), we should not bother discerning and make the double a takeout of the blacks. If we consider frequency, when opener has any other distribution we will be more likely to hold a red takeout; and conversely when opener does have that one rare 2-card club opening, we are less likely to hold a 4-4 red takeout and when we do, it is less likely to be a successful intervention.

[Siegmund]

I like playing this double as takeout of spades even if 1C is completely natural - X, 1NT, and 2NT are more ways than we need to show the same two suits - though playing a strong notrump in this spot does provide an incentive to put more 4-5s back into the double, and is perhaps an excuse to go back to playing the double as a two-suit takeout.

[Winstonm]

This is an interesting auction as a number of bids need some kind of agreement. If you plunk in sandswich NT, you have all sorts of bids available to show all sorts of shape/strength. To wit, 1C-P-1S-(X, 1NT, 2C, 2S, 2N) are all available for takeout. The question to resolve is what is best.