[TWO4BRIDGE]

@ Broze ( post # 20 ):
How about 1♠-2♥-3♥-3♠?

Putting aside the Serious/Frivolous question for the moment,
the normal interpretation for the following 2/1 GF auctions is as follows:

1M -2m!
3m - 3M is Double-fit auction where the Major as the established (trump) suit .

The ONLY exception is:
1S - 2H!
3H - 3S where ♥ is the established (trump) suit and 3S is a Ctrl cue bid .

[JLOGIC]

broze, on 2013-May-11, 01:20, said:

How about 1♠-2♥-3♥-3♠?

Double fit is probably more common but I think cuebidding is better. So for me it would be non serious and 3N would be a serious spade cue, but it's a partnership decision.

[Siegmund]

One certainly can swap the meanings of 3S and 3NT when hearts are trump if one wants.

My partner and I considered doing this but ultimately didn't, even though we did in numerous other auctions (for instance giving 1H-2S and 1S-2NT the same meanings.)

The reason we didn't was that when a minor was agreed as trump, 3NT (and 4NT) waiting bids in cuebidding auctions were passable. Even though you can swap them around so that the artificial bid is 3M+1 in a major suit auction, you cannot do "always 3m+1" or "always 4m-1" in a minor suit auction. We found it easier to have one package of cuebidding agreements, rather than have to have separate rules over minors and majors.

There is also the matter of how often your opponents will make lead-directing doubles in your cuebidding auctions. If most of your opponents are playing simple "I want this led" or "I have a card here" doubles they will double a lot more often over an artificial or control-denying bid than they will over a natural control-showing bid. Whether that is good or bad depends how much work you have done to take advantage of the extra step you gain after their double, and whether you think you get enough use out of that extra step to compensate for what the defense learns.

[Zelandakh]

JLOGIC, on 2013-May-10, 09:40, said:

Honestly this is probably the same thing as being a slave to 3N serious, my brain is probably just a slave to keycard being at the 4 level, I have never played 3 level keycard since my mind has not gone there. So I cannot really comment whether trump cue is worth the step. I will say that trump cue (and I should point out trump cue means GOOD trumps, eg don't cuebid Kxxxx or Axxxx just because you have a top honor, that can be found out in keycard, but sometimes when you have Qxxx opp Kxxx it's hard to avoid slam since if either player had the jack it is a very good slam but it's pretty pitiful without it, and keycard cannot resolve that. If you have bad trumps and your partner bypassess showing good trumps then that is often helpful for this problem).

I can offer you a solution to this. Use one of the additional steps you have after RKCB as a trump SSA, asking for the trump knave.

JLOGIC, on 2013-May-10, 09:40, said:

I will add that Roy and Sabine (my new gurus on cutting edge stuff along with you and PhilKing ) often have 3 level keycard and they play it as optional (so partner can refuse to answer, actually they play double optional so you can ask, partner declines, you can re-ask, partner declines even more, then you stop lol) often have this. I feel like relay systems often have this in general also so it seems less weird to relayers (my impression is once shape is resolved often the first step is min/max and you zoom controls with max, and the next steps are keycards for suits, excepting the terminator bid and 3N, is this true?).

That is not dissimilar to the conditional KCB method that I sometimes advocate for 4 level minor suit agreements, where the first step declines a slam try and higher steps accept and show key cards. I have never come across two denials and a third ask before though.

My own relay system works just as you describe, a minimum (9-11 and 0-4 controls) bids the first step and a hand with the same shape and extras (12+ or 5+ controls) zooms to controls. My relay breaks are different though; I do not use a terminator bid and instead condense all of the RKCB asks into 4♣ and 4♦. I prefer to use the space below 3NT to look for the best game, with stopper asks or to set a suit as trumps for a "natural" cue bid auction. That is just me though; I know several of the other relayers like their relay breaks to be RKCB even below 3NT. Occasionally a suit can be set at the 2 level like this, then the cue bids start there with the first step as Frivolous. In this case, 3 of the trump suit is often RKCB. I cannot see any reason why the same method cannot be ported to 2/1 in similar cases.