[ucrman]

After the auction 1H-1S-3S-4C, does a 4H bid or a pass offer more encouragement to go on? 3S was a splinter in support of Hs.

[Vampyr]

The usual agreement is that 4♥ is a sign-off and 4♦ a last-train type bid, but it is possible to reverse these meanings, or to play them differently depending on whether one or more hands have been limited.

[Codo]

Did I understood this right- both opponents bid?

I do play this:
pass: no club control
4 ♦ club control and diamond control SI
4♥ club control, but hates the splinter
X Club control, SI

But this is surely not standard.
In general, 4 ♥ would be less encouraging in this situation.

[PhilKing]

When the opponents bid to the four level, we can DOUBLE THEM FOR PENALTIES. Not all of our options should be geared towards slam bidding - some should deal with the mundane. With that in mind:

Double = penalties
Pass = I have nothing to say
4♦ = slam try
4♥ = I would like to play in Four Hearts

Pass is not encouraging (though it is unlimited), but it keeps open the option of defending. Four hearts should be a decent minimum, giving partner the option to bid 5♥ over 4♠.

[Zelandakh]

Phil, what is the difference for you between a direct 4♦ and Pass followed by removing partner's double to 4♦?

[PhilKing]

Zelandakh, on 2013-March-07, 06:45, said:

Phil, what is the difference for you between a direct 4♦ and Pass followed by removing partner's double to 4♦?

N/a, because the next hand is probably about to bid 4♠. 4♣ is often (usually) a raise to 4♠ and definitely is for many pairs. If I pass 4♣ I am almost certainly passing a double.

My only explicit slam try below game is 4♦ (train).

[inquiry]

1H-(1S)-3S-(4C)
?


First pass is the strongest of bids below 4H, in my mind, and 4H bid here is the weakest. I agree that 4C is penalty oriented if 4C is to natural to play, I assume however, but maybe wrong that 4C is probably a fit nonjump setting defense against a heart contract and showing a raise to 4S.

Pass followed by pull of dbl to 4D is stronger than an immediate 4D.

Some reverse the meaning of "forcing pass" of course.

[ucrman]

The actual auction was 1H-1S-3S-4D. In this auction there was no slam try below 4H.

[PhilKing]

inquiry, on 2013-March-07, 10:47, said:

1H-(1S)-3S-(4C)
?


First pass is the strongest of bids below 4H, in my mind, and 4H bid here is the weakest. I agree that 4C is penalty oriented if 4C is to natural to play, I assume however, but maybe wrong that 4C is probably a fit nonjump setting defense against a heart contract and showing a raise to 4S.

Pass followed by pull of dbl to 4D is stronger than an immediate 4D.

Some reverse the meaning of "forcing pass" of course.

It's not a fast arrival situation at all, because the destination on the front of the train is 4♠.

Assuming 4♣ is a spade raise, they are committed to play in 4♠x unless we bid in front of them. So if we prefer to defend 4♠x than play 4♥, double 4♣. If we are not sure (ie we want to defend 4♠x if partner has a nondescript 1444, but want to play 5♥ opposite, say, a 1543 hand with decent playing strength, we pass.

So it is logical that 4♥ encourages partner to bid 5♥ over 4♠ unless he has rubbish. In fact, it is encouraging, period.

We could invert the meaning of double and pass, but not that of 4♥.

ucrman, on 2013-March-07, 10:57, said:

The actual auction was 1H-1S-3S-4D. In this auction there was no slam try below 4H.

It seems optimal to play 4♥ (which is essentially an idle bid) as mildly encouraging, since with waste in spades we would prefer to make them play 4♠x.

[aguahombre]

ucrman, on 2013-March-07, 10:57, said:

The actual auction was 1H-(1S)-3S-(4D). In this auction there was no slam try below 4H.

I think we could have two last trains, if we wanted in this variation. Pass without a club control and double with. We don't have room, IMO, to consult partner about bidding 5H/4S if we are not slamming, but she will know if she has the extra offense or defense to choose.

With the (OP) 4♣ call, we seem to have 4♦ last train with a club control, and double or pass for the LT without ---the other one showing willingness for pard to compete at the 5-level.