[32519]

After a 1♣ opening, I see more and more players using some or other treatment of Kaplan Inversion to get the strong hand as declarer when responder has a positive response. One structure often seen is this –

1♣-1♥ (promising a 5-card ♠ suit and 8+ HCP)
1♣-1♠ (promising a balanced hand, no 5-card major and 8+ HCP)
1♣-1NT (promising a 5-card ♥ suit and 8+ HCP)

If this is becoming the “standard” how does responder show a 5+ card ♦ or ♣ suit now?

[straube]

I thought Kaplan Inversion referred only to switching the responses of 1S and 1N to 1H. It doesn't refer to any transfer or cipher.

I think you should study up on symmetric relay structures. Google transfer oriented relay system, etc.

If you'd rather play a Precision structure, you could try Meckwell responses...

1D-0-7
1H-8+ spades or 11-13 bal
1S-8+ hearts
1N-8+ clubs
2C-8+ diamonds
2D-8-10 balanced
2H-14+ balanced

and while I forget the rest, you could use those for your 4441 hands.

[kenrexford]

If Meckwell treat a hand with at most a seven-card suit, any shape, as balanced and have four bids dedicated to 8-card suits, they must have one Hell of an unwind.

[straube]

kenrexford, on 2012-May-16, 20:30, said:

If Meckwell treat a hand with at most a seven-card suit, any shape, as balanced and have four bids dedicated to 8-card suits, they must have one Hell of an unwind.

lol

[Mbodell]

32519, on 2012-May-16, 16:39, said:

After a 1♣ opening, I see more and more players using some or other treatment of Kaplan Inversion to get the strong hand as declarer when responder has a positive response. One structure often seen is this –

1♣-1♥ (promising a 5-card ♠ suit and 8+ HCP)
1♣-1♠ (promising a balanced hand, no 5-card major and 8+ HCP)
1♣-1NT (promising a 5-card ♥ suit and 8+ HCP)

If this is becoming the “standard” how does responder show a 5+ card ♦ or ♣ suit now?

In the form of tosr I play we sort of do this, except our suits are 4+ (cheapest first, not necessarily longest):

1♣:
1♦ - negative
1♥ - 4 or more spades
1♠ - balanced, no 5 card suit, no stiff; OR, two suiter with both hearts and diamonds
1NT - 4 or more hearts
2♣ - 4 or more diamonds, single suited or 3 suited with both minors.
2♦ - 5 or more clubs, single suited.
2♥ and above show specific 2 suiters with both minors.

If you skip showing some suit then you deny it, except for the 3-suited with both minors where you skip showing the major.

[Cthulhu D]

straube, on 2012-May-16, 17:14, said:

I thought Kaplan Inversion referred only to switching the responses of 1S and 1N to 1H. It doesn't refer to any transfer or cipher.

I think you should study up on symmetric relay structures. Google transfer oriented relay system, etc.

If you'd rather play a Precision structure, you could try Meckwell responses...

1D-0-7
1H-8+ spades or 11-13 bal
1S-8+ hearts
1N-8+ clubs
2C-8+ diamonds
2D-8-10 balanced
2H-14+ balanced

and while I forget the rest, you could use those for your 4441 hands.

I thin Meckwell use 2S for the 4441 hands with 2NT as an asking relay.

[Free]

32519, on 2012-May-16, 16:39, said:

If this is becoming the “standard” how does responder show a 5+ card ♦ or ♣ suit now?

2♣ and 2♦ perhaps?

[32519]

Free, on 2012-May-17, 02:24, said:

2♣ and 2♦ perhaps?

Love it!

The ♣ suit has already been bid, albeit artificial. Actually what I had in mind was how to keep the strong hand as declarer when responder has a positive response and a long minor suit. How about this (in being consistent with the OP):
1. 2♣ = Positive response, 8+ HCP and 5+ card ♦ suit. Opener with a 3-card suit can accept ♦ as (a potential) trump suit by bidding it. Now responder can continue by showing the rest of his shape.
2. So how do you now show a 5-card ♣ suit and 8+ HCP? If you choose to do this with a 3♣ bid, you are consuming your own bidding space. This could possibly still be acceptable if 3♣ denies a 4-card major.

[Zelandakh]

I took the TOSR structure mentioned above and further optimised it for right-siding purposes and to make sure a 4 card major was always shown first when held:-

1♦ = negative
1♥ = 4+ spades, if balanced then also 4 hearts, GF
1♠ = no 4 card major, GF
1NT = hearts or hearts and clubs, GF
2♣ = hearts and diamonds, GF
2♦ = 4-5 hearts and <4 spades, bal or 3-suited
2♥ = 4-5 spades, 2-3 hearts, bal, GF
2♠ = 4-5 spades, 0-1 hearts, 3-suited

To show a hand with a minor suit and no major, first respond 1♠. If partner now rebids 1NT (relay) then
2♣ = diamonds or 5+ diamonds and 4 clubs
2♦ = clubs
2♥ = balanced
2♠ = 5+ diamonds, 5+ clubs
2NT = 4 diamonds, 5 clubs
3♣ = 4 diamonds, 6 clubs, 0-1 spades, 2-3 hearts
3♦ = 2164
3♥ = 3064
3♠ = 1174
3NT = 7+ diamonds, 4 clubs, spade void
4♣ = 7+ diamonds, 4 clubs, heart void, min

I believe this base structure is close to optimal for symmetric-style responses while Meckwell's responses are probably close to optimal for a "longest-suit first" response structure. There are some hands where one works out better than the other but overall I do not think there is a clear case that either one is better. One thing I am pretty sure of, though, is that 1♣ - 1♥ as a GF positive with 5+ spades is sub-optimal. There are far too few hands included in this important response with that agreement. Make it either 4+ spades, or 5+ spades and another hand type. The second hand type does not have to be balanced (as it is in Meckwell).

Incidentally, please do not refer to this as Kaplan Inversion. That is a specific convention and applies only after a 1♥ opening.

[32519]

Zelandakh, on 2012-May-18, 03:00, said:

Incidentally, please do not refer to this as Kaplan Inversion. That is a specific convention and applies only after a 1♥ opening.

The players I saw/know using the method in the OP never had an official name for the treatment. For the lack of anything better I chose to add "something similar." No offense.

[robdixon87]

32519, on 2012-May-17, 03:01, said:

The ♣ suit has already been bid, albeit artificial. Actually what I had in mind was how to keep the strong hand as declarer when responder has a positive response and a long minor suit. How about this (in being consistent with the OP):
1. 2♣ = Positive response, 8+ HCP and 5+ card ♦ suit. Opener with a 3-card suit can accept ♦ as (a potential) trump suit by bidding it. Now responder can continue by showing the rest of his shape.
2. So how do you now show a 5-card ♣ suit and 8+ HCP? If you choose to do this with a 3♣ bid, you are consuming your own bidding space. This could possibly still be acceptable if 3♣ denies a 4-card major.

Or just make 2♦ your club positive, since you are no longer using it to show diamonds ;-)