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What is this double in you partnership ?

Poll: What is this double in you partnership ? (21 member(s) have cast votes)

The double should be

  1. penalty (19 votes [90.48%])

    Percentage of vote: 90.48%

  2. t/o (2 votes [9.52%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.52%

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#1 User is offline   bluecalm 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 12:52

1♥ - pass - 4♥ - pass
pass dbl

Please no "in pick-up partnership this is...", this is serious question about the best agreement, not about practical choices when you don't know and have to guess.
So... ? :)
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#2 User is offline   Hanoi5 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 13:07

What double?

 wyman, on 2012-May-04, 09:48, said:

Also, he rates to not have a heart void when he leads the ♥3.


 rbforster, on 2012-May-20, 21:04, said:

Besides playing for fun, most people also like to play bridge to win


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#3 User is offline   ArtK78 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 13:12

Clearly takeout. Or penalty.
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#4 User is offline   bluecalm 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 13:17

Damn I am sorry :) Edited OP to add the bidding :)
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#5 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 14:18

I have it defined as penalty, i.e. trumps not breaking.
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#6 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 14:29

Penalty. An equally relevant question is "what is 4'♠'?
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#7 User is offline   wyman 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 14:31

penalty here, I could have taken out 1H.
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#8 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 15:04

View PostPhil, on 2012-February-10, 14:29, said:

Penalty. An equally relevant question is "what is 4'♠'?

If you think that there are some hands that might want to bid 4♠, shouldn't you use double for that hand-type instead?
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#9 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 15:16

View PostPhil, on 2012-February-10, 14:29, said:

Penalty. An equally relevant question is "what is 4'♠'?

View Postgnasher, on 2012-February-10, 15:04, said:

If you think that there are some hands that might want to bid 4♠, shouldn't you use double for that hand-type instead?

I think Phil was not asking a question. I smiled, anyway; if it wasn't an attempt at irony or some other form of humor, it served that purpose for me.
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#10 User is offline   bluecalm 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 15:16

Quote

Penalty. An equally relevant question is "what is 4'♠'?


I have opinion of two world champions, granted in some toy categories (juniors and univ) but still who think it's for takeout so don't be so fast to judge...

Quote

I could have taken out 1H.


Well... what about: KQxx - KJTxx JT9x, aren't you tempted to fight ? :)
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#11 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 15:21

View Postwyman, on 2012-February-10, 14:31, said:

penalty here, I could have taken out 1H.

View Postbluecalm, on 2012-February-10, 15:16, said:

Well... what about: KQxx - KJTxx JT9x, aren't you tempted to fight ? :)

View Postwyman, on 2012-February-10, 14:31, said:

penalty here, I could have taken out 1H.

"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#12 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 15:51

View Postbluecalm, on 2012-February-10, 15:16, said:

Well... what about: KQxx - KJTxx JT9x, aren't you tempted to fight ? :)

I would have doubled 1♥ with that. I think that applies to all three-suiters that might want to act at the four-level.

If there's a hand where you might want to act, it must be a two-suiter.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#13 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 15:51

View Postbluecalm, on 2012-February-10, 15:16, said:





Well... what about: KQxx - KJTxx JT9x, aren't you tempted to fight ? :)



Thats an auto DBL of 1♥
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#14 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 16:02

A 2H overcall.
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#15 User is offline   FrancesHinden 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 16:04

I've replied given my partnership agreement (penalty) but you've missed out "two-way" as an option in your poll, i.e. either

- 4 or 5 good hearts, penalties, or
- void heart, very distributional, not strong enough to act over 1H

which is playable
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#16 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 16:33

View PostPhil, on 2012-February-10, 14:29, said:

Penalty. An equally relevant question is "what is 4'♠'?



To me 4♠ if vulnerability is friendly is something like this if i am playing with a conservative preempter, basically gambling (some call it completing the xfer) ;

Jxxxxx
x
Kxxx
xx

Unless of course our style allows us to overcall 2♠ with this at the first place. Call me maniac but thats 2♠ overcall for me at favourable or equal. I find this more comfy than talking myself into bidding or passing over 4♥ :)
"Genius has its own limitations, however stupidity has no such boundaries!"
"It's only when a mosquito lands on your testicles that you realize there is always a way to solve problems without using violence!"

"Well to be perfectly honest, in my humble opinion, of course without offending anyone who thinks differently from my point of view, but also by looking into this matter in a different perspective and without being condemning of one's view's and by trying to make it objectified, and by considering each and every one's valid opinion, I honestly believe that I completely forgot what I was going to say."
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#17 User is offline   bluecalm 

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Posted 2012-February-10, 17:18

Ok guys, if this is too obvious, what about:

1♥ pass 3♥ pass
pass dbl = ?

Btw, I doubled with KJT8x of trumps on previous one and I still stand for penalty but I can see argument for playing this as t/o and I don't consider it ridiculous at all.
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#18 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2012-February-11, 03:20

View Postbluecalm, on 2012-February-10, 17:18, said:

Ok guys, if this is too obvious, what about:

1♥ pass 3♥ pass
pass dbl = ?

I can imagine wanting to make a three-suited takeout double at this level, with a 40xx shape which is just too weak for a double of 1♥, eg K10xx - KJTxx JT9x. That's certainly more likely than a penalty double.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#19 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2012-February-11, 03:24

View Postbluecalm, on 2012-February-10, 17:18, said:

Btw, I doubled with KJT8x of trumps on previous one and I still stand for penalty but I can see argument for playing this as t/o and I don't consider it ridiculous at all.

It's unusual for the defenders to have five trumps on this auction. What sort of hand did responder have?
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#20 User is offline   Poky 

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Posted 2012-February-11, 05:32

Polarized. Pure penalty or thin takeout.
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