[dwar0123]

What is the proper way to bid south's hand playing fairly vanilla 2/1.

---

1nt = forcing
2♣ = could be short

What is the correct bid. Out of curiosity, what do the bids 3♣ or 4♣ mean in this auction?

[mike777]

BART is a very common convention played after this start.

The main purpose of BART is to find out openers heart holding in case responder holds 5 but responder can also show other hands.


Playing BART 3c after 2c would show 5+ card support and less than inv values, a blocking bid.

With more you start with 2d which asks pard to describe her hand further.


2d says you have 1 of a few hand types, most common is 5 hearts, others include invitational hands in either minor or really good hands with 2 card spade support.

[mgoetze]

I'm not very good at "vanilla" 2/1, but I think I would pass at IMPs and bid 2♥ at MPs.

3♣ shows an invite based on a potential club fit, say Qx Kxxx xx AQTxx. Basically you're asking partner to judge whether 3NT is on taking into account that you have 5+ clubs. 4♣ does not exist as far as I'm concerned.

[quiddity]

In vanilla 2/1 opener can have something like 17 points for his 2♣ rebid and he can have as few as three clubs. Responder's 3♣ rebid "keeps the ball in play" in case opener has a maximum; it will typically show 8-10 points and 5-card club support. With fewer points responder would just pass 2♣ because game is impossible. With 11-12 points responder can frequently invite with 2NT.
A 4♣ rebid is rare but I guess it would be a very distributional invite.

With the OP hand South has a choice between raising to 3♣ and giving false preference to 2♠. I suspect it is better to give false preference because the most likely game is in spades and because Hx support is pretty good. If you raise clubs instead partner is unlikely to correct back to a 6-card spade suit.

I don't understand a 2♥ bid; you will likely end up playing there opposite a stiff.

[mgoetze]

 quiddity, on 2012-February-07, 19:29, said:

I don't understand a 2♥ bid; you will likely end up playing there opposite a stiff.

I would have thought 2♥ invites partner to correct back to 2♠ if he does not have at least Hx but maybe there are different styles. Anyway I don't even play Forcing 1NT if I can avoid it at all so I'm not very qualified to comment.

[MrAce]

 dwar0123, on 2012-February-07, 17:54, said:

What is the proper way to bid south's hand playing fairly vanilla 2/1.

---

1nt = forcing
2♣ = could be short

What is the correct bid. Out of curiosity, what do the bids 3♣ or 4♣ mean in this auction?

In std methods i would bid 3♣ but i am not in love with this bid. This hand has very big pottential imo.

AKxxx x xxx KJxx and we have hell of a hand.

In our methods, we play 1♠--3♦ invitational so i can probably bid 3♦ with this showing ♣ fit + short ♦. But otoh we dont play 2♣ can be short. It is 3+

EDIT: Disregard my comment about 1♠--3♦. We play it invitational but that doesnt mean lack of using it i can not have 6[dia] and inv hand because i can not bid 3♦ with x Kxxx AQTxxx xx

[dwar0123]

 MrAce, on 2012-February-07, 20:44, said:

In std methods i would bid 3♣ but i am not in love with this bid. This hand has very big pottential imo.

AKxxx x xxx KJxx and we have hell of a hand.

In our methods, we play 1♠--3♦ invitational so i can probably bid 3♦ with this showing ♣ fit + short ♦. But otoh we dont play 2♣ can be short. It is 3+

EDIT: Disregard my comment about 1♠--3♦. We play it invitational but that doesnt mean lack of using it i can not have 6[dia] and inv hand because i can not bid 3♦ with x Kxxx AQTxxx xx

Wow, very close MrAce, I had the closed hand and it was actually AKJxx x QJx Kxxx.

We actually played in 5 clubs, though 4 spades is just as good, the method by which we got there was insanely risky though(pard just jumped to 5 clubs with the original hand) and I want to assure him that there is a safer way to get there.

[mike777]

 dwar0123, on 2012-February-07, 23:20, said:

Wow, very close MrAce, I had the closed hand and it was actually AKJxx x QJx Kxxx.

We actually played in 5 clubs, though 4 spades is just as good, the method by which we got there was insanely risky though(pard just jumped to 5 clubs with the original hand) and I want to assure him that there is a safer way to get there.

btw playing BART you have a 2s rebid which is very often 5=1=3=4 shape

cant stand 2h.

now easy to play in 5c or 4s

[MrAce]

 dwar0123, on 2012-February-07, 23:20, said:

Wow, very close MrAce, I had the closed hand and it was actually AKJxx x QJx Kxxx.

We actually played in 5 clubs, though 4 spades is just as good, the method by which we got there was insanely risky though(pard just jumped to 5 clubs with the original hand) and I want to assure him that there is a safer way to get there.

Not very hard to guess the shape if 2♣ is 3+. 5♠+3/4♣+3/4♦ because opps are silent pd rates to have some ♦s and thats why i thought the hand is bigger than it looks, pd is very likely to be short in ♥ suit and ♠Q is valuable.

But for some reason this hand looks familiar to me, i may have played it, is it BBO hand ?

[dwar0123]

 MrAce, on 2012-February-08, 00:17, said:

Not very hard to guess the shape if 2♣ is 3+. 5♠+3/4♣+3/4♦ because opps are silent pd rates to have some ♦s and thats why i thought the hand is bigger than it looks, pd is very likely to be short in ♥ suit and ♠Q is valuable.

But for some reason this hand looks familiar to me, i may have played it, is it BBO hand ?

No, was a hand from today on okbridge, my father likes being rated so he switched to okb a few months ago and I play with him there.