[bluecalm]

So Lauria - Versace play this way:

1♠ - 2♣
2♠ - 2NT

And now:
3♣ = 4 clubs
3♦ = 3 clubs, then ask for amount of spades
3♥ = 6+spades, no 3 clubs, at least decent hand (13 good hcp or more)
3♠ = 6+spades, no 3 clubs, very weak hand
3NT = 5-3-3-2 exactly

My question is what do they do with 6spades - 4clubs.
I gather that:

1♠ - 2♣
2♠ - 2NT
3♣ - 3♦ = relay

But it seems to me from vugraph hands that opener just shows a stiff here (so 5-(3-1)-4) or bids 3NT with 5-2-2-4.
If we try to pack 6-4 hand into this 3clubs and have some high answer to relay then there will be problems with setting up spades as trumps.
Do you have any ideas ? Or maybe some of you play similar system and could help me out with this one ?

[MrAce]

 bluecalm, on 2012-February-03, 12:09, said:

My question is what do they do with 6spades - 4clubs.
I gather that:

1♠ - 2♣
2♠ - 2NT
3♣ - 3♦ = relay

But it seems to me from vugraph hands that opener just shows a stiff here (so 5-(3-1)-4) or bids 3NT with 5-2-2-4.
If we try to pack 6-4 hand into this 3clubs and have some high answer to relay then there will be problems with setting up spades as trumps.
Do you have any ideas ? Or maybe some of you play similar system and could help me out with this one ?

Perhaps they dont show 6-4 and 5-4 hands differently ? When they show stiff over 3♦ that can be 6-4 or 5-4 perhaps. And/or perhaps they dont bid 2NT with 3♠ and/or they dont bid 3♦ over 3♣ but 3♠ with 3 ? Idk, interesting.

[wank]

 MrAce, on 2012-February-03, 13:10, said:

Perhaps they dont show 6-4 and 5-4 hands differently ? When they show stiff over 3♦ that can be 6-4 or 5-4 perhaps. And/or perhaps they dont bid 2NT with 3♠ and/or they dont bid 3♦ over 3♣ but 3♠ with 3 ? Idk, interesting.

yes if responder can't handle a 4x response to the relay he can just bid 3nt - the only time he won't want to play in a black suit opposite 6-4 is when he's stacked in the reds.

4c/d/h/s for the 4 combinations of 64

[bluecalm]

Quote

And/or perhaps they dont bid 2NT with 3♠

I think they generally don't but still setting spades as trumps if they are 6-2 seems to be important.

Quote

hey dont bid 3♦ over 3♣ but 3♠ with 3 ?

Yeah, I am pretty sure they bid 3S with 3 spades but still the problem of spades 6-2 remains.

The only vugraph hand with sequence:
1S - 2C
2S - 2N
3C - 3D

has 3NT alerted and explained as 5-2-2-4 (but you never know with alerts on vugraphs).

On one other hand Sementa-duboin bid:
1S - 2C
3C with 6S-4C but very good hand (perfect 14hcp). I guess weak 6-4's go into 2S from general structure of the system but what next ?

[diejowae]

1♠- 2♣
2♠- 2NT
3♣- 3♠ ? (set trump slam try)
4♠(min hand)
4♦/♥ (short) max/goodhand.