[Antrax]

Well, a mild objection at least.

[gwnn]

People replying to general statements* by pointing out exceptions that were already acknowledged in the original statement and then acting like they have disproved the whole thing. E.g. "This event has been largely ignored by media." "Oh yes? How about that article in the New York Times [50 words somewhere on page 33]?"

*-of course making too many general statements is also undesirable as they are fertile ground for weasel words to spread, etc.

[Fluffy]

There is a commercial on Tv about a detergent that is imitating a sound that is related to social networks when you have a new message (simialr to new messages on BBO in old browser as well). It plays it many times and it drives me nuts.

It makes me so angry that I spent some time looking for a page where I could ask it to be put down. After many failures I found the right page to do so, just that the submit button is broken and doesn't work on any browser.

[kenberg]

 Vampyr, on 2013-September-25, 22:35, said:

When they make an announcement before a TV program is shown about things that people might find objectionable, and they say "mild language". Who could possibly object to "mild language"?

I suppose someone who prefers strong language might object. What is most needed is an advisory that says "really stupid plot".

[Cyberyeti]

 kenberg, on 2013-September-26, 05:43, said:

I suppose someone who prefers strong language might object. What is most needed is an advisory that says "really stupid plot".

"May contain lots of explosions and no plot", is that worse ?

[GreenMan]

 kenberg, on 2013-September-26, 05:43, said:

I suppose someone who prefers strong language might object.

Once on a trip from Boston to NY the bus I was on had TV screens showing a cleaned-up version of an action movie. In one scene the two manly protagonists had a long argument over which one of them was the bigger foul-up, i.e., which one fouled up more often in life. I'd have much rather heard the unexpurgated dialogue.

[barmar]

 GreenMan, on 2013-September-26, 08:00, said:

Once on a trip from Boston to NY the bus I was on had TV screens showing a cleaned-up version of an action movie. In one scene the two manly protagonists had a long argument over which one of them was the bigger foul-up, i.e., which one fouled up more often in life. I'd have much rather heard the unexpurgated dialogue.

There's a web site that shows samples of the 10 silliest redubs of R-rated movies. The champion, of course, is "Snakes on a Plane" -- in Samuel L. Jackson's iconic line "I've had it up to here with these mother-F'ing snakes on this mother-F'ing plane", they replaced the curses with "Monday-to-Friday". The one I remember from years ago is watching "Smokey and the Bandit" on regular TV: Jackie Gleason (the titular smokey) curses constantly, and they were dubbed over by someone with a noticeably higher voice.

[mycroft]

"yippee ki yay, Mr. Falcon", anybody?

Oh, and I saw "Four Weddings and a Funeral" on an airplane. The opening scene was ... interesting.

There are those that will object to mild language (quite rare), and there are those who wish to ensure that their children aren't exposed to mild language (many more, and they will be quite insistent on the fact outside. They have obviously never been on a schoolyard). There are some - like my grandfather - who objected to even mild language - but he never used it either (or at least, when he did, he was alone, and was explained as 'oh bother'.) But that was simply because it wasn't necessary to use that language to get his point across (even if his point was vituperative). That's a skill that is not considered important any more (which is why it's fun to be *able* to do it) - so at this point who cares?

[Vampyr]

 mycroft, on 2013-September-26, 09:45, said:

There are those that will object to mild language (quite rare), and there are those who wish to ensure that their children aren't exposed to mild language (many more, and they will be quite insistent on the fact outside. They have obviously never been on a schoolyard).

Not quite with you here -- are you suggesting that language on a schoolyard is mild? "Excuse me, young man, would you be so kind as to return my ball?" or "Please don't insult my mother, if it's all the same to you"... I guess I haven't been on a schoolyard in a long time.

[Cyberyeti]

 barmar, on 2013-September-26, 09:35, said:

There's a web site that shows samples of the 10 silliest redubs of R-rated movies. The champion, of course, is "Snakes on a Plane" -- in Samuel L. Jackson's iconic line "I've had it up to here with these mother-F'ing snakes on this mother-F'ing plane", they replaced the curses with "Monday-to-Friday". The one I remember from years ago is watching "Smokey and the Bandit" on regular TV: Jackie Gleason (the titular smokey) curses constantly, and they were dubbed over by someone with a noticeably higher voice.

A guy I went to school with is a fairly well known film critic in the UK. He tends to talk about movies in mid afternoon so can't repeat a lot of the dialog. He refers to it as melon farming which works reasonably well.

[Trinidad]

I am not a complete $%&@# *&^%^&%$! I know that my children hear a lot of $^%&^%é€% language on the &^$##>< school yard.

But that doesn't mean that I want them to get the idea that it is normal behavior among adults.

Rik

[mycroft]

I was trying to find the "notalwaysright" example of someone who took something as highly offensive because "how dare you say it in front of my kids" - even though it was more-than-mild (but possibly implying that homophobia isn't "normal" - as I said, I couldn't find the example).

She thought that her ideals for her kids were what everyone must abide by, because it was "her kids". As I said, people like that have never been on a schoolyard, and probably think it *does* sound like Vampyr's (well, not Etonian gentlemanly, but "kids is so innocent, they'd never say anything like that.")

[kenberg]

Speaking in front of kids: I think it's a tricky business, and generally I would respect the wishes of the parents. Coping with adult expectations and adult hypocrisy is a challenge for youngsters, and I would not get in the way of parent/offspring negotiations. I think that this means avoiding some topics when the kids are around.


As far as "offensive words" are concerned, that can be more amusing. I saw Kiss Me Kate in 1953, including the song I hate Men. I think I recently told this story but here it is again. Listening to the evening disc jockey, I heard this song being requested by a girl I knew, dedicated to a boy I knew. The DJ declined, citing FCC rules. !? Had I missed something? I guess he, or the FCC, had the original cast recording. The line "Of course I'm awfully glad that mother had to marry father" became, in the movie, "Of course I'm awfully glad that mother deigned to marry father". And I can't recall how the line "Don't forget it's he who has the fun and thee the baby" got revised. Otoh, Barbara Stanwyck got away with a lot. In The Lady Eve, Henry Fonda is devastated to find that Barbara Stanwyck is a notrious card shark rather than the innocent soul that he had believed her to be.She is hurt by his treatment of her but says something like "At least I'm glad you found out this morning rather than last night if that means anything to you". Actually such remarks were generally permitted. In Three Coins in a Fountain, Jean Peter's friends strongly argue that her boss must apologize to her for things that he has implied about her relationship with an Italian. "He owes me no apology at all, none at all" or some such reply. Facts were stated, but phrasing was gentler, much gentler. This is not all bad.

[Vampyr]

 mycroft, on 2013-September-26, 11:49, said:

I was trying to find the "notalwaysright" example of someone who took something as highly offensive because "how dare you say it in front of my kids" - even though it was more-than-mild (but possibly implying that homophobia isn't "normal" - as I said, I couldn't find the example).

She thought that her ideals for her kids were what everyone must abide by, because it was "her kids". As I said, people like that have never been on a schoolyard, and probably think it *does* sound like Vampyr's (well, not Etonian gentlemanly, but "kids is so innocent, they'd never say anything like that.")

Well, there are things expressed in mild language that people might not like said in front of their kids, like statements about homophobia if they are homophobes themselves for example, but on the other hand, "mild language" suggests that there is no cussing, no rudeness and presumably no raised voices, so it is hard to imagine someone objecting to it wholesale.

[blackshoe]

I'm pretty sure it wouldn't occur to TV producers to put anything in that list that people haven't objected to in the past.

[barmar]

Most parents try to do what they can to shelter their kids. Even though they know they can't stop them from hearing objectionable language when they're out of home, when they're in control they prefer to limit it.

BTW, I don't think I often heard much cursing on the playground when I was growing up in suburban Long Island. It wasn't until I went away to sleepaway camp in the summer after 5th grade (so I was 10 years old) that I encountered it among kids on a regular basis. And I still remember the stunned reaction my parents had when my sister (a year younger than me) used one of the words she learned that summer in front of my grandmother.

[kenberg]

 barmar, on 2013-September-27, 09:54, said:

Most parents try to do what they can to shelter their kids. Even though they know they can't stop them from hearing objectionable language when they're out of home, when they're in control they prefer to limit it.

BTW, I don't think I often heard much cursing on the playground when I was growing up in suburban Long Island. It wasn't until I went away to sleepaway camp in the summer after 5th grade (so I was 10 years old) that I encountered it among kids on a regular basis. And I still remember the stunned reaction my parents had when my sister (a year younger than me) used one of the words she learned that summer in front of my grandmother.

Actually this matches my experience. It was not until I went to high school that I was immersed in a lot of vulgarity. Of course I grew up in the middle of the last century.

The way I see it, I don't feel kids should be all that much sheltered. But they shouldn't have their noses rubbed in the unpleasantness of life either. I was six when we dropped an atomic bomb on Hiroshima. My parents did not discuss this with me, and I am pretty sure that I would have been sent from the room if any neighbor felt the need to discuss it. Or the neighbor would have been told to shut up. Not to shut the eff up, my father didn't talk that way. But to shut up about it when Kenny is around.

[blackshoe]

 barmar, on 2013-September-27, 09:54, said:

Most parents try to do what they can to shelter their kids. Even though they know they can't stop them from hearing objectionable language when they're out of home, when they're in control they prefer to limit it.

BTW, I don't think I often heard much cursing on the playground when I was growing up in suburban Long Island. It wasn't until I went away to sleepaway camp in the summer after 5th grade (so I was 10 years old) that I encountered it among kids on a regular basis. And I still remember the stunned reaction my parents had when my sister (a year younger than me) used one of the words she learned that summer in front of my grandmother.

I heard "objectionable language" in high school, from my friends. I never even knew my father knew those words until I was twenty-five.

[Fluffy]

By learning to avoid using 'bad' language in front of your parents you learn to behave on other circumstances like work environment.

[GreenMan]

Best strategy I ever heard was from a friend; her teenage son used some vulgar language for the shock value in front of her, and she just said, "You can say whatever you want to at home, but if you use those words around people you don't know, they may not like you and lose respect for you." She said after that she never heard him swear in an inappropriate setting.

I guess the message "Don't do that, it's wrong" is much less useful than "Here's what will happen if you do that." Kids with agency can usually figure out what to do with it.

*No kids of my own, so I'm not speaking from experience.