[shyams]

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This is how the bidding went at our table. Would appreciate feedback on which call was the worst...

[rogerclee]

I can't imagine passing over 3D with the south hand, it is an automatic 4H bid to me. Given that north showed competitive values with minimal diamond waste and often a 4th trump, south had an easy game bid the second time, even though 3H was not invitational.

[mcphee]

The big issue with this hand is N holds 4 trumps. The responders trump length is a key point if South should make a game try. Opposite 3 trumps life may not treat S well once he gets tapped on the go, opposite 4 trumps it is a new ball game. Good things happen with 5-4 fits, terrible things when 5-3.

So it basically bears down to should I risk a possible minus score trying for game. You did not post the vul,which helps for you next post. I think trying for game facing 3 trumps will not work well very often.

[EricK]

If the bidding had gone 1♥ (P) 2♥ (P), I can't imagine any South staying out of game. Even if the 2♥ in a competitive auction doesn't promise quite as much, after North freely rebids 3♥, South just has to bid game IMO. Personally, I think South has a 4♥ bid on the second round, as North really ought to have something for his raise, either in ♣ or ♠, either of which must be useful.

[marcD]

I would dbl with the south hand unless I am worried partner may misinterpret it (game try clearcut at IMP; more difficult at MP especially if oppponents are vul as partner may go for the magic 200). Think 4♥ is premature , better consult partner as he may have only 3 trumps and/or diamond wastage.

[rogerclee]

BTW part of the reason I am just bidding 4H is to maximize pressure on them to save in 5D. I don't want anyone to be able to suggest it without actually doing it.

[MrAce]

I dont know the scoring but in teamgame i would just bid 4♥ with south hand. If i was too conservative player or if it was MP i would have at least invite via DBL over 3♦. Passing is out of question, it is 14 hcp but A-We now know we have a fit B-We now know opponents have ♦ hcps and we are void.

If i failed to do any of the above and passed and my pd came back with 3♥ which is strong indication of 4 trumps, passing again is awful imo. Thus %100 South in fault.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

who has undisclosed strenght? South.

So the answer to your question warrants a wtp.

Pass over 3D is ..., either bid 3H or 4H, or X.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[jdeegan]

South 110%. Imho this is a 4♥ bid over pards 2♥ raise. For more detailed analysis, see MrAce's comment.

[neilkaz]

South 100% at fault. North did absolutely nothing wrong here . Proper wording for the OP question would be. "Is the missed game South's fault or just bad luck?"

[Yu18772]

South - 100%, both passes are the worst bid.

[mikestar13]

Obvious 4♥ from South. This is surely worth an invitation in an uncontested auction, so with both sides showing a fit,give them a guess.

[mcphee]

I am a bit surprised after reading some of the remarks placing all this blame on poor south. It is easy to see that 4H is a good game seeing all 4 hands. I wonder how this group would feel facing only 3 trumps, lets give him slightly different values and place him with the Axx in trumps and the Qxx in C and see how you manage in 4H, which all of a sudden becomes a tad hopeless. You are in a hard spot taking a tap any time trumps split 4-1. We require specific cards (usually the ones partners do not hold) to have a shot at game. The colors posted are equal non vulnerable, not making the risk of losing the game bonus a major factor.

Bid game and hope you make it has a lot of appeal to me facing the right sort of opportunity. I see things in a different way. First the hand that called 2D rates to hold opening values making that K of C look not nearly as valuable. Most of the time partner will not hold 4 trumps. We can bid 3H to play, 4H and hope it has a chance, or double as the only sensible game try. Double could result in partner passing when he hold Qxxx of D and Axx in H along with a black Q. This sort of hand is not at all unreasonable. Facing this hand you might even fail in 3H when trumps are 4-1.

Being non vulnerable I just do not see any evidence that bidding game is pointing in my favor. For those who blast 4H in the hope the enemy will save in 5D I wish you well. Decent opps are not so keen on equal vul saves when on hand in known to hold reasonable values, like an opening bid over your hand. Good players are not making an o/c on some random 10 count.

[mikestar13]

By the way, North will usually have that fourth heart for his 3♥ bid--there are a very fair number of three three-card raises where North would have sold to 3♦,and those three-carders where he will try 3♥ will have a very high ODR.

[Free]

I blame South twice. He should've acted over 3♦, and even if he didn't he should've bid 4♥ after partner's 3♥. South has a lot to learn about hand evaluation, he should stop thinking "we have maximum 14+9=23 HCP so we can never make game"

[Mbodell]

This is like the clearest of these ATB I've seen in a while. It is so 100% South. You could maybe argue 4♥ is too aggressive over 3♦, but passing is worse. And over 3♥ 4 seems mandatory.

[whereagles]

rogerclee, on 2011-December-24, 05:26, said:

I can't imagine passing over 3D with the south hand, it is an automatic 4H bid to me.

4H? More like an automatic 4D

Remember pard has a weakish hand, so he can hardly go berserk on this bid. Which may be helpful to him to reevaluate and eventually bid 5H if necessary.