[han]

Here is an interesting board from the transnationals.

AKQxxx
xxx
x
AQx

10x
AKQxx
xxx
Kxx

Our auction was the following:

1S - 2H
2S - 2NT
3H - 3S
4C - 4H
5C - 5H
5S - pass

We don't often cuebid to slam so we were in somewhat unchartered waters. It later turned out that we were on the same waverlength for all our bids, but still we missed the quite decent slam(s).

2S did not show 6 spades, 2NT is somewhat balanced but could be 2-6-3-2 or 1-5-4-3 for example. 3H could be a doubleton, and 3S shows exactly a doubleton.

That's all pretty ambiguous, but now things became clearer. 4C, 4H, 5C and 5H were all cues for spades. Opener must have 6 spades, and therefore must also have 3 hearts (with 6 spades and a doubleton heart opener would bid 3S instead of 3H).

Should responder have bid 6S holding the heart queen? Or should opener clarify his hand type immediately by jumping to 3S? Would the auction have been simpler if opener had bid 4D over 2NT, assuming that that is a splinter for spades?

[kgr]

han, on 2011-October-29, 10:28, said:

That's all pretty ambiguous, but now things became clearer. 4C, 4H, 5C and 5H were all cues for spades. Opener must have 6 spades, and therefore must also have 3 hearts (with 6 spades and a doubleton heart opener would bid 3S instead of 3H).

Can you explain this?
Why did opener cue 4H and 5H when he has a ♦-control and already showed 3cH?
Why is responder cueing C twice with only Kxx?

[han]

I edited.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

I also do not understand the absence of a control cue of 4D in the given auction

But, if opener knows that a delayed Ht rebid may only be as few as TWO cards, then bid support immediately to show at least 3 cards:

1S - 2H ( 2/1 GF )
3H - 4C ( courtesy cue )
4S! ( kickback RKC for Hts ) - 5H ( 4th step = 2 + hQ )
6H

[aguahombre]

I make spades as a better slam than hearts by a tick, so would like to be assured of a two-card fit before using twofor's sequence. Then I can place the final contract in spades after wooding for hearts.

Why is it better? Well, on the given ten-x of spades there is an extra 4-1 we can bring home. Also there is a slight chance that there will be no diamond lead and the same player with JXXX of spades also has three hearts.

[Flem72]

Distasteful immediately to raise hearts with xxx (NOT primary support in my book, and = Hx), but I don't think any p'ship I'm in would find it without that raise so tht courtesy cues could begin. Otherwise, either

1S-2H
3C-3H
? (now, 4D cue possible, but S then not likely to cue Cs)

or

1S-2H
2S-3H
4C-4H? (blech; R's 2N would be a D card)

or

1S-2H
3S-4S
? (unless the S suit includes the ten, not quite the kind of suit we like for this choice).


Most likely to succeed?:

1S-2H
4D (again, the S suit is a white lie).

Regards and Happy Trails,

Scott Needham
Boulder, Colorado, USA

[han]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-October-29, 12:10, said:

I also do not understand the absence of a control cue of 4D in the given auction

Presumably responder didn't think that xxx was strong enough to cue.

Quote

But, if opener knows that a delayed Ht rebid may only be as few as TWO cards, then bid support immediately to show at least 3 cards:

1S - 2H ( 2/1 GF )
3H - 4C ( courtesy cue )
4S! ( kickback RKC for Hts ) - 5H ( 4th step = 2 + hQ )
6H

How would you feel about playing in if responder held Jx AQxxx AKx Kxx? I would feel pretty miserable, not only about the contract but also about my decision to insist on hearts when I held AKQxxx of spades and xxx of hearts.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

han, on 2011-October-29, 12:23, said:

Presumably responder didn't think that xxx was strong enough to cue.

How would you feel about playing in ♥ if responder held Jx AQxxx AKx Kxx? I would feel pretty miserable, not only about the contract but also about my decision to insist on hearts when I held AKQxxx of spades and xxx of hearts.

You have a point.
6S makes even w/o the hQ in the above Responder hand:

Jx Axxxx AKx Kxx

6s, 1h, 2d, 3c = 12

[andy_h]

I think the auction was fine up to the point of 4H. At first I thought opener should probably just keycard given responder denied any cuebid in diamonds but then I thought it would get us to a silly slam opposite Jx AKxxx Qxx Kxx or something. But on the other hand it is often the case when nobody keycards and both sides cuebid up to the 5 level noone can be very certain how many keycards we are missing. So it boils down to what the 5 level cuebids by opener means. What does 5C show/deny? Does it only promise 2nd round control in diamonds for otherwise you would have cuebid 5D? Or does it merely confirm 1st and 2nd round control in clubs with either 1st or 2nd round control in diamonds?

It feels like for me that when opener cuebids 5C (as opposed to keycard) they are probably looking for a source of tricks somewhere as they might be looking for 3rd round control fillers. If opener has a diamond shortage then most likely they are looking for something that can handle 3rd round controls in hearts/clubs, but if opener's diamond control was in the form of say Ax they either would have keycarded or they are also interested in a source of tricks. But what would 5S over 4H be? Maybe it announces something like this hand (no 2nd club control, no 1st diamond control, not much help in hearts therefore good trumps)? Given the proposed auction can opener have something like AKJxxx xxx KJx A? If so then responder probably can't bid 6S over 5S in the proposed auction.

Well I don't have a solid solution. Maybe you can assign a meaning of 5D "cuebid" for responder which doesn't say "I have 3rd round control in diamonds (assuming the 4-level cuebids were 1st or 2nd round)" but rather give it a meaning that might be more useful. Or maybe you can incorporate a 3C multimeaning after a 2/1 auction of 1M-2x-2y-2NT so you can differentiate strengths when opener needs to bid 3M somewhere along the lines to show the 6th spade? They're just some ideas...

Btw I'm curious - how did you know opener has 3H instead of 2H? You mentioned that with 6S2H they would bid 3S over 2NT, but what if opener had 6133 or 7123 do those hands bid a 3m fragment, or...?

[han]

andy_h, on 2011-October-30, 03:55, said:

Btw I'm curious - how did you know opener has 3H instead of 2H? You mentioned that with 6S2H they would bid 3S over 2NT, but what if opener had 6133 or 7123 do those hands bid a 3m fragment, or...?

I knew because I was opener, but I mentioned it because I wanted to steer the discussion past some points. It is clear from the auction that opener has a good 6-card spade suit, and it is clear from responder's hand that opener has no top heart honor. With only a doubleton heart, opener would not bid 3H but 3S. With a singleton heart, opener would obviously also not bid 3H.

The point I was trying to make is this: given that opener bid 3H and later showed a very good hand with a good 6-card spade suit, opener must have 3 hearts.

Perhaps I should only have given responder's hand to see if people could read that the heart queen is the essential card and would bid 6.

[Zelandakh]

I think the auction is great except for the final pass. If Opener had a spade loser then surely they would have preferred key card to cue bidding the CQ. So South can see there are only 2 losers, a diamond and a heart. But we have the HQ so there is only one loser. I think it is correct for South to bid 6H now. And (sorry for this) I cannot resist posting my own auction...

1S = 10-17 unbal
... - 1N = INV+ relay
2S = max, 6+ spades, no 4 card side suit, GF
... - 2N = relay
3C = 3 hearts
... - 3D = relay
3H = 3 clubs
... - 3S = relay
3N = 6313
... - 4C = relay
4S = 5 controls
... - 6H

[Fluffy]

Goded-Lantaron had this hand and they had a sequence very similar to yours except that instead of going to the 5 level north keycarded.

South for a extrange reason decided that they were in 6 keycard auction, but decided that he would only show 2 keycards (including ♥K), but no trump queen since the only queen that matters is the one in spades.

after south´s failure to bid a diamond cuebid north though he was so huge that he would drive to slam anyway, not fully sure if 6 keycard blackwood was on or not.


Similar to my father´s thoughts I think on your auction north is at fault, facing no diamond control the hand must fit perfectly, sure there are some lieouts where you need a heart finese, even ones where there is no play, but expecting a partner missing ♠AKQ to bid slam on his own is asking too much.

[gnasher]

After North's 3♥, I think South should bid 4♣, confirming hearts as trumps. 3♠ risks getting to the wrong trump suit opposite, for example, ♠AKJxxx ♥xxx or ♠AKQxxx ♥Jxx. The 4♣ cue-bid would make things fairly easy - North has enough to bid Keycard now.

With your actual auction, I think North should be nervous about driving the five-level. Can he be facing Jx AQxxx Qxx KJx, or would that hand refuse to cue-bid?

[han]

Quote

With your actual auction, I think North should be nervous about driving the five-level. Can he be facing Jx AQxxx Qxx KJx, or would that hand refuse to cue-bid?

I don't think that this is a good way to think about bridge at all. Of course it is possible that partner has the worst hand possible, and if so, the 5-level may be too high. Partner has denied a diamond control, if you bid 4S, partner will very likely pass. The 4H bid is very good news, and I think that missing slam when you bid 4S is far more likely than going down at the 5-level (or 6-level) when you move past 4S. Of course going down at the 5-level is not something I like to do, but if it happens it loses about the same number of IMPs as missing slam. We shouldn't fear one more than the other.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

han, on 2011-October-29, 10:28, said:

Here is an interesting board from the transnationals.

AKQxxx
xxx
x
AQx

10x
AKQxx
xxx
Kxx

Another reason for North ( Opener ) to show 3 card Ht support on his rebid with x x x ( I know it was "poo-pooed" here ) is that
finding out about the ♥Q is important if and when he takes control ....And what better way to find out than with a key-card ask.

And if the auction permits, he has the top dog Spade suit as the slam suit choice.

1S - 2H ( 2/1 GF )
3H - 3NT ( would have bid 3S with 3 cards... so less than 3 cards Sp )
4C - 4H ( no Diam Ctrl; actually this is good news... must have helpful hcp in CLUBS and perhaps the ♠J for his 2/1 GF)
4NT - 5S ( 2 + ♥Q )... and the 2 key cards MUST be the ♥ A & K !!!
6H/6S

[JLOGIC]

I think you are right but it's a tough hand. The key is for your partner to basically realize you have shown a stiff diamond, and driven to the 5 level knowing you're of the ace of diamonds plus the four keycards he has, ergo your trumps are AKQ. At the time he was probably thinking "I'm minimum and have cuebid several times for partner." These auctions never seem to go as well in real life as they do on paper, which I know you know, but I still understand why you bid how you did worried about the third round of hearts. Maybe depending on your partner's level it would have been practical to bid 6 over 5H since he probably wouldn't have even cuebid again for you with the HQ being a different card even though he should.

[gnasher]

han, on 2011-October-30, 15:42, said:

I don't think that this is a good way to think about bridge at all. Of course it is possible that partner has the worst hand possible, and if so, the 5-level may be too high. Partner has denied a diamond control, if you bid 4S, partner will very likely pass. The 4H bid is very good news, and I think that missing slam when you bid 4S is far more likely than going down at the 5-level (or 6-level) when you move past 4S. Of course going down at the 5-level is not something I like to do, but if it happens it loses about the same number of IMPs as missing slam. We shouldn't fear one more than the other.

But we should use the available information to judge which is more likely. Over 3♥, opener chose to suggest spades as trumps rather than agreeing hearts, even though his spades are at best headed by the jack. That makes it quite likely that we have at least one heart loser. If we have a heart loser and a diamond loser, we're not going to make slam. If we have two heart losers and a diamond loser, we're not going to make anything at the five-level either.

Also, when opener has good enough hearts for slam he may well move himself. On South's actual hand, after 1♠-2♥;2♠-2NT;3♥-3♠;4♣-4♥;4♠, I think he should probably make another move. Although he is minimum, all of his honours are working.

[Phil]

Han, did you try bidding this with yours and Cherdano's methods starting with 1♠ - 2♣?

[TWO4BRIDGE]

han, on 2011-October-29, 10:28, said:

Here is an interesting board from the transnationals.

AKQxxx
xxx
x
AQx

10x
AKQxx
xxx
Kxx

Ok, one more try:

1S - 2H! ( 2/1 GF w/5+Hts )
2S - 2NT
4D! ( self-splinter: now there is no question that ♠ is 6+ cd suit and a good one at that ! )

[han]

Phil, on 2011-October-31, 07:57, said:

Han, did you try bidding this with yours and Cherdano's methods starting with 1♠ - 2♣?

No, I would never bid 2C with this hand and to be honest I don't remember the system I played with cherdano.