[dickiegera]

King spades is a doubleton in East's hand

---

I bid 3♣. Partner bid 3NT. I bid 4♠. Making 7 on a heart lead.
Spade King is doubleton East. Diamonds are 2-2.

Makes 7NT,7♠or 7♦
Can we get there??

Thank you

[aguahombre]

I don't think so because of what North actually has. But if North's hand were KX AX AQXXXX XXX, for instance, then 4D minorwood (6 keys, including spades)by South would get it done. South can convert to spades or NT at the appropriate slam level.

[Flem72]

First of all, the problem doesn't care where the KS might be, does it? Second, wouldn't you be happy to reach eithre 6D or 6S? Edit: or 6N, figuring out a C lead?

I posted a similar problem at http://www.bridgebas...8080-sequence1/
which did not get much attention. Truscott's "Bidding Dictionary" defines the unopposed sequence 1D-1S/2D-3C as forcing once, 11+ HCP, 5?/6? 3- 3- 3+? distribution, but I suspect many would bid this way with 4-3-1-5 and no H card.

I had the same auction -- 1D-1S/2D-3C/3N-4S -- with a partner the other day. Our auction was screwed up for other reasons, but it started me thinking about this auction because it would seem to be, generally, system-independent: Is R making a choice-of-games decision or is s/he slammish? After emailing around, I think we decided this (assuming 6 Ss in R):

2S = weak
3S = inv
4S = minimumish to good opener with good S
3C then 4S over 3N = slammish opposite cover-type cards, at least good S and extras. O should look very carefully at the alleged minimum with long diamonds to judge whether s/he holds important cards.

Regards and Happy Trails,

Scott Needham
Boulder, Colorado, USA

This post has been edited by Flem72: 2011-September-17, 11:57

[aguahombre]

Yeh, Scott. We could look at it as a 5 or 7 hand with a club lead ---or a 6 or 7 hand without one, and just go forward with the odds. I wasn't looking at it that way, but rather from the standpoint of being able to count 14 tricks on a different layout.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Flem72, on 2011-September-17, 09:39, said:

First of all, the problem doesn't care where the KS might be, does it? Second, wouldn't you be happy to reach eithre 6D or 6S?

I posted a similar problem at http://www.bridgebas...8080-sequence1/
which did not get much attention.
Boulder, Colorado, USA

A major problem with both examples is the use of "NMF" ( 3C ) when Diam are rebid.
[ It works just fine --saving bidding rooom -- when Clubs is the rebid suit ].

3C takes up valuable space.
Better to use "cheapest new suit forcing" -- here 2H! ( which maybe artificial ).

1D - 1S
2D - 2H!
??
Now, if Opener had 3 cards Sp, he can show that at the 2-level.
Here, though, w/o 3s, but a Ht-stop, he can rebid 2NT ( also denying 4h -- otherwise would rebid 3H ) -- again at the 2-level.

Now it is Responder's turn -- to either show a 6th Sp (3S ) or Diam support ( 3D ) -- both of which are game forcing since you chose the artificial new suit route instead of the direct 3-level invitational rebids .

1D - 1S
2D - 2H!
2NT - 3S
4S - 4NT ( RKC )
5H ( 2 - sQ ) - 6S ( no reason to try for 7 when missing a key card )

[Flem72]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-September-17, 10:40, said:

A major problem with both examples is the use of "NMF" ( 3C ) when Diam are rebid.
[ It works just fine --saving bidding rooom -- when Clubs is the rebid suit ].

3C takes up valuable space.
Better to use "cheapest new suit forcing" -- here 2H! ( which maybe artificial ).

I understand the usable space advantages here, but would you distort a 6S-4C hand to use 2H? For reference, the actual responding hand for the other thread(not given there) was

AQ98xx
Ax
x
AJxx.

Regards and Happy Trails,

Scott Needham
Boulder, Colorado, USA

[jmcw]

North has taken a very conservative view of his hand and the auction.
Why did South bother to bid 3♣?. It should indicate a hand too good to bid 4♠!. 3♣ indicated slam interest.

IMO, North should advance, cautiously, I'm not sure whats best 5♦, perhaps?

[aguahombre]

jmcw, on 2011-September-17, 11:56, said:

Why did South bother to bid 3♣?. It should indicate a hand too good to bid 4♠!. 3♣ indicated slam interest.

Not necessarily. There are those of us who do not treat

1m-1S
2m in the same ways we treat:

1m-1S
1N...and are reluctant to directly blast in a six-card suit before hearing more.

[Fluffy]

The bidding should start: (and anything else is a mistake)


1♦-1♠
2♦-2♥
2NT-3♦

there are many ways to reach slam after that, but on the proper strain: ♦.

EDIT: there might be (heart) lead issues wich make 3♠ rather than 3♦ continuation better.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Flem72, on 2011-September-17, 11:16, said:

I understand the usable space advantages here, but would you distort a 6S-4C hand to use 2H? For reference, the actual responding hand for the other thread(not given there) was

AQ98xx
Ax
x
AJxx.

Regards and Happy Trails,

Scott Needham
Boulder, Colorado, USA

I think with the above Responder hand ( 6s/4c ) , I would still like to show a 6th Sp with GF bidding.
[ Also, Opener might show a 4 card Cl suit as a lower priority if he doesn't have 3s or 4h or a Ht-stop ).

I'd reserve the following 3C! rebid to show 5-5 in the blacks:
1D - 1S
2D - 3C ( natural, also forcing; although this might conflict with the Walsh folks who have a 4s/6s weak hand )

[ggwhiz]

The 4♠ bid over 3nt strikes me as too little. I would bid 4♦ as a clear slam try and likely hear 4♥ next.

Not being good enough to unravel a 5 or 7 hand I'm sure we would land in 6♦ at the end. My partner often has a singleton spade for this auction.

[rbforster]

Strong jump shift to 2♠ initially would make things a lot clearer.