[billw55]

Interesting. When this was played, my expert (?) partner rebid 2♥, and when I questioned this he maintained that any NT call absolutely promises a stopper in the fourth suit (diamonds).

[han]

Expert partners say the strangest things here on the forums...

[matmat]

han, on 2011-June-23, 00:19, said:

Expert partners say the strangest things here on the forums...

hmm... maybe we need a separate thread/blog/forum title "Experts say the darndest things!" A little compendium of genius BBO quotes (I really should start writing down some of the stuff I see online).

[Free]

Why is everyone talking about "good advertisement for blabla" and "if 1♠ is unbalanced". It's not unbalanced, otherwise it would've been alerted, and there aren't any special agreements, otherwise it would've been stated by the OP. You might as well claim you're in a GF situation after East opened a strong 15+HCP 1♣ and West bid a GF 1♥ response. Come on, this is the beginner/intermediate forum.

The hand isn't that nice, you've got a lot of Quacks so a downgrade is definitely possible. I like a heavy 1NT because it smells like a misfit and we're not strong enough to force to game. The only alternative imo is 2NT which gets risky without a ♦ stopper.

Your expert partner is not as expert as you think Bill.

[Cyberyeti]

Free, on 2011-June-23, 06:17, said:

Why is everyone talking about "good advertisement for blabla" and "if 1♠ is unbalanced". It's not unbalanced, otherwise it would've been alerted, and there aren't any special agreements, otherwise it would've been stated by the OP. You might as well claim you're in a GF situation after East opened a strong 15+HCP 1♣ and West bid a GF 1♥ response. Come on, this is the beginner/intermediate forum.

The hand isn't that nice, you've got a lot of Quacks so a downgrade is definitely possible. I like a heavy 1NT because it smells like a misfit and we're not strong enough to force to game. The only alternative imo is 2NT which gets risky without a ♦ stopper.

Your expert partner is not as expert as you think Bill.

Because in half the bridge world, 1♠ is always unbalanced (well strictly not balanced, 4225 is possible but considered semi balanced by the EBU and others) and this is unalertable, you rebid 1N with balanced hands. It would also be considered completely absurd to bid 1N over 1♠ without a diamond stop in many places.

[Free]

Cyberyeti, on 2011-June-23, 07:06, said:

Because in half the bridge world, 1♠ is always unbalanced (well strictly not balanced, 4225 is possible but considered semi balanced by the EBU and others)

Please get your facts straight before posting such nonsense.

[VM1973]

I agree with those who recommended 2NT. Checkback Stayman might also work if you play it as a one-round force. Personally I prefer it as game forcing, especially when playing IMPs.

[Cyberyeti]

Free, on 2011-June-23, 07:14, said:

Please get your facts straight before posting such nonsense.

Well it's applied to EVERY partner I've ever played with encompassing most of the big bridge countries of the world, including those I've played a strong no trump with from US, France, Spain, Pakistan and China (not suggesting it's necessarily routine in those places, just it was routine to the people I've played with from those places to rebid 1N if the hand was balanced). It's always been 99% routine in the UK, although I suspect with more people playing 5M 2/1 it may be becoming less so.

[Stephen Tu]

helene_t, on 2011-June-22, 11:25, said:

One problem with playing 2♦ as "invitational or stronger" is that if opener rebids 3♣ to show a sixth club we don't know if he has extra values or not. I suppose one could play 3♦ by opener now as showing extra values and not the right shape for a 3NT, 3♥ or 3♠ bid. Another problem is that if 2♥ by opener is nonforcing he would have to bid 3♥ with extra values and three hearts. That is a lot of space to take away without clarifying whether he has a diamond stop or not. Or with a diamond stopper, six clubs and slight extras he would have to bid 3NT, not showing the extra club length.

I think most of these problems are tractable. I like playing 2♠ by opener after 4sf here (current cheapest of opener's suits) as non-descript, *not* implying 5-6, since 5-6 is a rare hand type compared to the many hands where opener has no natural bid i.e. 4135 no diamond stop. If 2♠ is a PLOB, 3♣ can promise both six clubs and extras. With six clubs and a minimum, you can always just bid 2♠ then 3♣ if partner bids a NF 2nt, or pass partner's 3♣ invite.

2♥ by opener can be treated as 1RF.

If opener bids 3♥ to show extras, presumably he is 4315, no diamond stop unless stiff ace?

[mgoetze]

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[the hog]

mgoetze, on 2011-June-23, 16:54, said:

Since you quoted the entire post, I assume you meant to call all of it "nonsense". I would be interested in a list of jurisdictions where a 1♠ rebid showing 4 spades and promising longer clubs (or perhaps 5-5) is alertable.

So would I. I think to alert this is absurd.

[manudude03]

I don't think it's alertable in Ireland, but I have seen it alerted on numerous occasions. The general rule does seem to be that if you know something the opponents may reasonably not, alert it.

Anyway, I'll bid 3C (unless I have a non-GF 2D available). I am not bidding NT on an auction which screams for a diamond lead (especially true if you open 1D with 4-4 minors)

[Free]

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[mgoetze]

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