[jillybean]

2/1

1♠:1N*
2♣:3♦
3♠:

[menggq]

I think the key question is what's the 3♦ meaning?
1.3♦=SPL ♦single ♣5+(since 2♣ can be 4-cards) 10hcp+
2.3♦=good ♦suit inv hand

I prefer 3♦=SPL for ♣ FIT ♦single.

[Hanoi5]

Opener has a nice hand with clubs and 6 spades, responder some 10-12 with diamonds, very probably not balanced.

[Phil]

What is a direct 3♦?

[jillybean]

Phil, on 2011-May-13, 20:05, said:

What is a direct 3♦?

Bergen

[tolvyrj]

Im not a 2/1 expert so i would like to know what 2♦ would have meant?

[Lurpoa]

jillybean, on 2011-May-13, 18:11, said:

2/1

1♠:1N*
2♣:3♦
3♠:

Well, I play BWS2001 (with BART), and
in this sequence 3♦ is preemptive to play (Not invitational).

[FrancesHinden]

Without any specific other agreements, 3D is natural invitational - a decent 6-card suit. Opener would usually pass or bid 3NT; 3S should be forcing with good spades - with an unsuitable hand for diamonds, just pass.

[helene_t]

tolvyrj, on 2011-May-13, 20:38, said:

Im not a 2/1 expert so i would like to know what 2♦ would have meant?

The basic idea is that after a 1NT response, responder's second bid means the same as it would in a non-2/1 style but that bids that would be "impossible" in a non-2/1 style can be used for hands that are stronger than a 1NT-responce in non-2/1 style, i.e. appr 11 points.

Also, responder tries to cater to opener having only three clubs. So (needless to say the "points" should not be taken too literally except for the 2NT rebid):
1♠-1NT
2♣-?

- Pass: 5-7 points, 4+ clubs
- 2♦/♥: 5-9 points 5+ in the suit (non-2/1 textbooks might say 6+ but with 1(54)3 you have no other option since opener might have only 3 clubs)
- 2♠: 5-9 with two spades or 5-6(7) with three spades, depending on your agreements about the strength required for a direct 2♠
- 2NT: "impossible": appr 11 points, less than three spades
- 3♣: appr. 8-9 points, hopefully 5+ clubs. Try to bid 2NT with 11 points as that sounds more encouraging. Try to bid something else with only four clubs.
- 3♦/♥: "impossible": 10-11 points, 6+ card suit, hopefully a good suit
- 3♠: "impossible", 3-card limit raise. A direct 3♠ would show 4 (but some partnerships disagree with this, and some have other ways of showing a 3-card limit raise directly)

Some play a direct 3♦/♥ as showing a single suited hand with invitational values. Then you can use the indirect 3♦/♥ to show a splinter. Also, some play a different structure after the 2♣ rebid with responder's 2♦ now being artificial.

[helene_t]

duplicate response

[fromageGB]

helene_t, on 2011-May-14, 03:31, said:

Also, some play a different structure after the 2♣ rebid with responder's 2♦ now being artificial.

Elaborating, if 2♣ is natural, then 2♦ would be weak, to play. However, you may agree that 2♣ could be any strong hand (say 17+) and not necessarily clubs. Then a 2♦ reply would be a GF artificial positive to ask opener to clarify his hand. If this is the case, then a 3♦ rebid rather than a 2♦ rebid shows a very weak hand (6/7 count) with long diamonds, and can be passed. After this, 3♠ is a game force.

[jillybean]

FrancesHinden, on 2011-May-14, 02:56, said:

Without any specific other agreements, 3D is natural invitational - a decent 6-card suit. Opener would usually pass or bid 3NT; 3S should be forcing with good spades - with an unsuitable hand for diamonds, just pass.

This is how I hoped it would be understood. I held Axxxxx,Qx,x,AKJx and decided my A 6th spades weren't good enough to bid 3♠/1N (corrected typo, 3♠ not 2♠}
but hoped my 3♠ bid later would show 6.

This post has been edited by jillybean: 2011-May-16, 07:26

[Gerben42]

With a minimum, partner should pass 3♦ so he has extras with 6 - 4 but no stopper in ♥ and wants you to pick a game. Perhaps he has:

---

Note that 6 - 4 hands with a minimum would bid 2♠ directly, so that also
1♠ - 1NT - 2♣ - 2♦ - 2♠ shows this kind of hand.

[jillybean]

So, how do you bid 14hcp 6232 hands after 1♠:1N 2♣:3♦?

Do you support ♦'s and give up on a ♠ fit?

[cherdano]

jillybean, on 2011-May-15, 17:47, said:

So, how do you bid 14hcp 6232 hands after 1♠:1N 2♣:3♦?

Do you support ♦'s and give up on a ♠ fit?

You don't. I mean, you don't bid 2♣ with 6232 - either bid 2♠ or 3♠. Maybe rarely there is a hand where you would bid 2♦, but I would not do it very often, and certainly not with a 14hcp hand.

This post has been edited by cherdano: 2011-May-16, 03:10

[mike777]

BART

fwiw BART is a very common convention here.


3d=6d less than invite.


1s=1nt
2c=3d

iam rather surprised I am the first to mention this very very common conv.

AKxxx...xxx...x...AJxx

x....xxxx....AKJxxx....xx


2d here is artificial/most common is weakish with 5+h.

[jillybean]

cherdano, on 2011-May-15, 20:55, said:

You don't. I mean, you don't bid 2♣ with 6232 - either bid 2♠ or 3♠. Maybe rarely there is a hand where you would bid 3♦, but I would not do it very often, and certainly not with a 14hcp hand.

Partner bid 3♦, Im not suggesting opener bids 3♦.
Unless I have a weak hand with 6♠, I routinely bid 2♣/1N, why shouldnt I?

[helene_t]

jillybean, on 2011-May-15, 23:18, said:

Partner bid 3♦, Im not suggesting opener bids 3♦.
Unless I have a weak hand with 6♠, I routinely bid 2♣/1N, why shouldnt I?

Partner might pass 2♣
Or raise clubs. Then with extras I suppose you could bid 3♠ but that could get you too high. And p might insist on clubs, taking you back to 4♣/5♣.
It is true that 2♣ only shows three but that is when you have a balanced hand. Once you bid the spades again he will assume 6-4.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

We play 3D in this seq. as a Fit Jump, but we also play that the direct 3D bid
showes the inv. single suiter.

The weak single suiter, can be shown via 2D.

If you play, that 2D over 1S is GF - than it may make sense to play the delayed
jump as inv.

So the answer to the question, what 3D in the given seq. showes depends heavily on
the answers to the question, what does

1S - 3D and what does it mean if responder rebids his suit on the 3 level.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[P_Marlowe]

jillybean, on 2011-May-15, 23:18, said:

Partner bid 3♦, Im not suggesting opener bids 3♦.
Unless I have a weak hand with 6♠, I routinely bid 2♣/1N, why shouldnt I?

If you have a bid to show the 6th spade, instead of a bid that could be based
on a 3 card suit - why would you choose the less descriptive bid?
of course, if you play some artifical stuff, that involves a 2C relais to differentiate
various hand types / strengts, than by all means play it, but than menationed it and
hopefully your partner knoes as well, that 2C is artificial and forcing.

With kind regards
Marlowe