[iscbrooks]

When you have a five-card suit and a balanced hand (5-3-3-2) with the five in a major, and 15-18 HCP, when should you open the major and when would 1NT be preferrable? Take the following hands:

---

---

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Which ones would you recommend 1NT for, and which would 1S be better? What principle should influence the decision?

[EricK]

This is one of bridge's perennial questions.

My answer is that they should all be opened 1NT.

The principle to use is "Balanced hands should be bid as balanced hands"

Eric

[mr1303]

I agree. With each of those hands they should all be opened 1NT, as you want to be declarer whereever you finish up, with all your tenace positions. Say you end up in 3NT after a 1S opening and your partner declares, the lead will be going through your tenaces, which could well be worth 2-3 tricks.

The only time with 15-17 bal (playing a strong NT) that I won't open 1NT with a 5 card major is if I have a hand such as:

AKQxx
AKx
xxx
xx

when there really is no advantage to me playing the hand, as my tricks will be tricks no matter who declares the hand. However, with a small doubleton spade and a 5 card heart suit, I always open 1NT if in range.

Mark

[GaryFisch]

would not open 1st 1NT w/Qx - don't want to play NT - last two yes w/Kx

[the hog]

All balanced hands in the NT range should be opened with the appropriate NT bid. Shape is all important.

[EricK]

The_Hog, on Sep 6 2004, 07:09 AM, said:

All balanced hands in the NT range should be opened with the appropriate NT bid. Shape is all important.

What would you open if each hand were an Ace lighter?

Eric

[nickf]

Why do we open 1NT?
Because we are suggesting to partner that we have a balanced hand more suitable for NTs than suitplay.

Why do we play Stayman? So the partnership discussion (ie auction) can determine whether the hand belongs in NT or a suit contract.

Swap the hearts and spades in the three example hands you cite.

Say the auction proceeds 1H: 1S from partner:

1NT by you is now an underbid and 2NT from you is an overbid.

Nick

[the hog]

EricK, on Sep 6 2004, 05:33 PM, said:

The_Hog, on Sep 6 2004, 07:09 AM, said:

All balanced hands in the NT range should be opened with the appropriate NT bid. Shape is all important.

What would you open if each hand were an Ace lighter?

Eric

Playing a weak NT I would open that. Playing a strong NT you are forced to open 1M. I don't see the point of the question EricK. If the balanced hand falls outside your NT range you are forced to open something else.

[skorchev]

I will open 1NT with all of these hands.

There is a reason to open 1M if you play 1M-1NT forcing, then you can bid 2m and after 2NT, but still 1NT opening is better.


Stefan

[Free]

I will open ALL of these with 1NT as well. You have your range and distribution...

Theoretically, it might be better not to open the last hand, since you might end up in a 5-2 ♥ fit instead of a 5-3♠ fit when partner isn't strong enough for game. From the moment he's strong enough for game, I have a nice tool to find any 5-3 fit M, so that's no problem.
If you calculate the avarage of HCP partner has, you'll get something like:
15 -> 8.33 = 23.33
16 -> 8.00 = 24.00
17 -> 7.67 = 24.67
18 -> 7.33 = 25.33
So you can clearly see on average, your partner will have an invitational or better hand, so you won't be playing many 5-2 fits anyway. And IF you are playing a 5-2, you don't even always have a 5-3 available.
The few problem cases are too few to avoid NT-openings and get rebid problems imo.

[Fluffy]

I am quite happy to disagree with everyone here, since I will open every of them with 1♠.

The only hands I don´t open 1M when having 5 cards are when my suit is 109xxx or worse, or when having 21+ balanced, or when having both majors since I cannot open both majors at same time ).

[EricK]

The_Hog, on Sep 6 2004, 08:44 AM, said:

EricK, on Sep 6 2004, 05:33 PM, said:

The_Hog, on Sep 6 2004, 07:09 AM, said:

All balanced hands in the NT range should be opened with the appropriate NT bid. Shape is all important.

What would you open if each hand were an Ace lighter?

Eric

Playing a weak NT I would open that. Playing a strong NT you are forced to open 1M. I don't see the point of the question EricK. If the balanced hand falls outside your NT range you are forced to open something else.

The point of the question is that if you are playing a forcing 1NT response, then you can't show the balanced hand as a balanced hand.

So is the priority to show the balanced nature of your hand (which you can do by opening 1♣ or your better minor and rebidding 1NT or raising partner's ♠ bid) or to show the spade suit?

Eric

[goodwintr]

I recall Kaplan saying somewhere that he didn't think he had ever opened 1NT, holding a five-card major suit. That may be extreme -- but still, Kaplan's opinion is surely worthy of some respect, and might (perhaps) cause some of the respondents here to rethink their certainty that it is "always" right to open 1NT.

I also recall more than one occasion when opening the five-card major led to game in the major, bid and made, after a single raise from 1M to 2M -- while they opened 1NT at the other table and played it right there.

Conclusion? Here, as elsewhere, it doesn't pay to be dogmatic.

[goodwintr]

Having said what I just said, I would nevertheless open all three of the hands 1NT (if in range). Each of them has a "must-declare" holding, Kx or Qx, so you should go out of your way to get in the first notrump.

[whereagles]

I started playing bridge with 5-card majors openings. I tried to open 1M as often as possible back then, meaning no opening 1NT or 2NT with 5-card majors... Then I gradually started relaxing those requirements until I ended up playing a 1NT of 9-11 with 5-card major possible!

1NT openings are sooo descriptive and have such a good preemptive value that is hard to resist the temptation of showing your hand in one shot.

[luke warm]

i don't have this problem... with me, all the posted hands are opened 1S... as a matter of fact, with 5 spades i'd give some thought to opening 1S even if those were within my nt range... it's different with hearts, with H/S reversed and 12-14 i'd open 1nt in each case... i can't bid 1H/1S/1NT with 12-14

everything is governed by my possible rebids... if the hands posted were weak enough to fall within my nt range, opening 1S can get me in trouble (because of the forcing 1nt - no trouble if i played a semi-forcing 1nt)

[Free]

Yes, that's my opinion as well: with ♥ I don't have ANY problems of bidding 1NT, just to keep opps out of a possible 2♠ contract. With ♠ you might consider showing the ♠ suit to be able to compete (which you can still do when opps intervene your NT btw)

[Fluffy]

luke warm, on Sep 6 2004, 02:23 PM, said:

i don't have this problem... with me, all the posted hands are opened 1S... as a matter of fact, with 5 spades i'd give some thought to opening 1S even if those were within my nt range... it's different with hearts, with H/S reversed and 12-14 i'd open 1nt in each case... i can't bid 1H/1S/1NT with 12-14

everything is governed by my possible rebids... if the hands posted were weak enough to fall within my nt range, opening 1S can get me in trouble (because of the forcing 1nt - no trouble if i played a semi-forcing 1nt)

I don´t difference between majors for 1 reason: I won´t rebid 2NT unles spartner made a 2/1.

I mean that to me 1M-1NT-2NT is game forcing, 18-19 (and due to some other conventions it could be non balanced sometimes, but that´s out of the question).

when I hold a balanced 5332 with 15-17 I open 1M, and then rebid my best minor, that is regardless of playing 2/1, or whatever 5 card major system.

This works the same way when partner responds 1♠. (I actually have switched the 1♠-1NT meanings over 1♥ recently).

[MickyB]

I am swayed towards opening 1NT if:

- I am playing strong NT. It is the easiest way to show that I have extra strength.

- It is IMPs. 1NT tick is only an imp worse than 2S tick, and 3NT is only an imp down on 4S tick. At MPs it is worth a lot more.

- I have hearts. It is possible that both sides miss their major fit, and as they can outbid us at the same level this is likely to favour us.

- I want to declare (split honours).

- I'm not desperate for the suit to be led.

- I have a way to look for 5-3 fits when going to game.

- I do not have a lot of extra playing strength in the major suit. A maximum with hard honours could well miss game if it opens 1NT.

[paulhar]

GaryFisch, on Sep 6 2004, 01:55 AM, said:

would not open 1st 1NT w/Qx - don't want to play NT - last two yes w/Kx

If you have Qx and your partner has Axx, which hand should declare NT?

Quote

Each of them has a "must-declare" holding, Kx or Qx,

Exactly.