[Aberlour10]

What's your opinion? Do you preempt on 3-level with 4 cards in major suit on the side (especially in 1st or 2nd seat)? Yes? Sometimes? ( Explain pls under which circumstances you do or don't do) Never? (why...?) Thanks for comments.

[Phil]

Better if its hearts and not spades.

I don't have a big problem with it if the side suit isn't too strong, since 7-4's (which I might open with a 4 bid anyway) usually play better in the 7-1 than a 4-4 anyway.

[mgoetze]

Sure, why shouldn't I?

[Fluffy]

yes unless the suit is very strong

When 7-4 majors I normally open 4

[han]

Rarely, only when I'm fairly minimal, my main suit has good fillers and my 4-card major is weak.

A hand like x xxxx Kx QJ10xxx would be possible, especially white against red.

I would almost never do it in second seat.

(Of course the story is completely different if the main suit is a major as well)

[Gerben42]

I play that you may have one thing that doesn't fit in your hand, so if your hand is otherwise perfect, you can open 3x with a 4-card major. If your hand is so-so, don't. Remember that you have a partner.

Example good hand:

This is a good 3D opening

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Not vulnerable this is fine too

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4-card major and the void is too much - don't

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[han]

Gerben42, on 2010-December-24, 08:47, said:

Not vulnerable this is fine too

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I think that opening this hand with 3D is terrible, especially non-vul. The hand is so strong, you will often have game and there is a good chance that the best game is 4S. Give partner some minimal opening hands with 5 spades, you'll see he will often pass 3D when 4S is cold.

[Aberlour10]

han, on 2010-December-24, 08:52, said:

I think that opening this hand with 3D is terrible, especially non-vul. The hand is so strong, you will often have game and there is a good chance that the best game is 4S. Give partner some minimal opening hands with 5 spades, you'll see he will often pass 3D when 4S is cold.

This is exactly what happened to me ( on the similar 4-1-7-1 hand) and was the reason to start this topic.

[nige1]

Aberlour10, on 2010-December-23, 18:01, said:

What's your opinion? Do you preempt on 3-level with 4 cards in major suit on the side (especially in 1st or 2nd seat)? Yes? Sometimes? ( Explain pls under which circumstances you do or don't do) Never? (why...?) Thanks for comments.

Gerben42, on 2010-December-24, 08:47, said:

This is a good 3D opening

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Not vulnerable this is fine too

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han, on 2010-December-24, 08:52, said:

I think that opening this hand with 3D is terrible, especially non-vul. The hand is so strong, you will often have game and there is a good chance that the best game is 4S. Give partner some minimal opening hands with 5 spades, you'll see he will often pass 3D when 4S is cold.

Aberlour10, on 2010-December-24, 10:28, said:

This is exactly what happened to me ( on the similar 4-1-7-1 hand) and was the reason to start this topic.

Agree with Gerben42. For us, his second example is a trifle strong in first two seats but would be fine in third seat. When you pre-empt at the three-level, you normally deny opening bid strength. Opponents are likely to hold the balance of the points and are favourites to win the auction. Hence, pre-emption is more disruptive than constructive.

How disciplined your pre-empts are is a matter of partnership agreement. For some, however, there is a considerable element of poker-bluff in pre-empts. Terence Reese famously remarked "A pre-empt that is known to be weak is a blunt sword". The same goes for strength and length in side-suits. Zia Mahmoud is in favour of keeping opponents guessing about such things. So that when opponents win the auction, declarer can't rely on a blue-print of your shape and strength.

Sometimes, unfortunately, it is your hand but you miss a fit in your side-suit. That is the price you pay. In practice, however, there may be some consolation. Such hands often play as well or better in the long suit -- even opposite a shortage.

[Phil]

Gerben42, on 2010-December-24, 08:47, said:

I play that you may have one thing that doesn't fit in your hand, so if your hand is otherwise perfect, you can open 3x with a 4-card major. If your hand is so-so, don't. Remember that you have a partner.

Example good hand:

This is a good 3D opening vul vs not; otherwise its a great 4♦ opener

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Not vulnerable this is fine to open 1♦

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4-card major and the void is too much - don't open 3♦, but pass, 1♦ or 4♦ are more reasonable

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FYP

[han]

nige1, on 2010-December-24, 13:25, said:

Terence Reese famously remarked "A pre-empt that is known to be weak is a blunt sword".

Maybe he thought so but you would be hard stretched to find an expert today that would agree with this.

Quote

The same goes for strength and length in side-suits. Zia Mahmoud is also in favour of keeping opponents guessing about such things.

Somehow I think Zia Mahmood (as I believe it is spelled but I could be wrong) would not open 3D with this hand.

[nige1]

han, on 2010-December-24, 15:55, said:

Maybe he thought so but you would be hard stretched to find an expert today that would agree with this. Somehow I think Zia Mahmood (as I believe it is spelled but I could be wrong) would not open 3D with this hand.

Sorry. Han is right about the spelling of Zia's name