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Is this "normal"

#1 User is offline   the_dude 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 08:00



NV vs NV

My partner argues that it is "normal" in the advanced/expert class world to open this hand 1NT. I think he's on another planet .. if you want to mastermind a bit fine, but it is by no means "normal".

IMO this particular hand doesn't present alot of rebid problems .. but that aside .. what are your thoughts on opening 1NT with a singleton K in 1st position?
If no one comes from the future to stop you from doing it then how bad a decision could it really be?
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#2 User is offline   mike gill 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 08:12

No, this is not normal. Save it for when

1) You have a rebid problem
2) You don't have two 4-card majors in which to miss a fit
3) You really need a swing
4) You have a 3-card major (another way to win since partner can xfer)
5) You just feel like screwing with the opponents cuz you don't like them
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#3 User is offline   mfa1010 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 08:27

It is normal that "normal" bids are defended as being normal. This 1NT is an experiment.
Michael Askgaard
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#4 User is offline   hrothgar 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 08:36

I think its a pretty reasonable 1NT opening.

1NT lets me open with a preemptive bid, decreasing the chance of competition
I can use a single bid to precisely clarify strength and (approximate) my shape.

If I open 1NT, I'll be happy if partner bid Stayman and overjoyed if he transfers to a major.

The only auction where I'll feel at all queasy is

1N - 2N (transfer to Diamonds)
3C - 3♦

Which positions a level higher than

1♣ - 1♦
1♥ - 2♦

Balanced against this, the super accept might let use find a cheap game
Alderaan delenda est
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#5 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 08:46

I agree with Richard. It's reasonable, but that doesn't make it normal.
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#6 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 09:23

 mike gill, on 2010-November-17, 08:12, said:

No, this is not normal. Save it for when

1) You have a rebid problem
2) You don't have two 4-card majors in which to miss a fit
3) You really need a swing
4) You have a 3-card major (another way to win since partner can xfer)
5) You just feel like screwing with the opponents cuz you don't like them



AMEN
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#7 User is offline   mike gill 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 09:53

I would not feel all that happy if it went all pass (partner could have Txxx Qx xxx AJxx), or even if partner transferred and I superaccepted (unless he's supposed to raise my superaccept to game on Txxxx Ax xxxx Jx).
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#8 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 11:16

it's okay but it's not mandatory or normal. I wouldn't like to open 1C and hear partner bid 1M because I wouldn't know how high to raise him. I have a stiff K and no aces.
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#9 User is offline   MrAce 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 11:43

It depends on how we define the word "normal". If it is defined for something that majority of experts will do, then it is not normal.

I would open that hand 1 NT though.
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#10 User is offline   bid_em_up 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 12:20

 the_dude, on 2010-November-17, 08:00, said:



NV vs NV

My partner argues that it is "normal" in the advanced/expert class world to open this hand 1NT. I think he's on another planet .. if you want to mastermind a bit fine, but it is by no means "normal".

IMO this particular hand doesn't present alot of rebid problems .. but that aside .. what are your thoughts on opening 1NT with a singleton K in 1st position?


Change the hand to:



and your partner may be right. As it is, there is nothing to be gained from opening 1N on the hand in question and much to be lost.
Is the word "pass" not in your vocabulary?
So many experts, not enough X cards.
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#11 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 12:24

I echo those who say this is not normal. I disagree with the reationale (for 1N) that we won't know how high to raise a major response...I'd have no trouble bidding 3major...given that we have all the Kings, partner will almost always have a decent play for game with any hand on which he chooses to raise...or to venture toward slam.

I'd have more sympathy for 1N if the hand were a tad lighter or if we were 1=4=4=4....indeed, with K KQJx K10xx KQxx, I think that 1NT would be widely viewed as reasonable bordering on and for many becoming 'normal'.
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
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#12 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 12:45

Yup, agree with all that mikeh said.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#13 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 12:46

 mike gill, on 2010-November-17, 08:12, said:

No, this is not normal. Save it for when

1) You have a rebid problem
2) You don't have two 4-card majors in which to miss a fit
3) You really need a swing
4) You have a 3-card major (another way to win since partner can xfer)
5) You just feel like screwing with the opponents cuz you don't like them


Echo this and I would add:

6) Partner will frequently 3N on 4M333. This is very bad for us.
7) Partner will 3N on a lot of hands with clubs where 5♣ is better than 3N.
8) Partner will trap pass a 2♦ overcall with HTxx of ♦. This is bad for us too.
9) If we open 1N we have zero chance to get to a 4-3 major fit which looks pretty good with this texture.
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#14 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 13:00

I think that Phil's additions are only on the edge of badnessness. Not the things I would worry about.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#15 User is offline   mtvesuvius 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 13:18

I would open 1N if 1444 probably, however I'd open this 1♣ for sure... Agree with Phil and Mike.
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#16 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 13:24

Fine now I'm with 3M over 1M. hm feeling kind of malleable lately.
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#17 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 14:03

Best to say fewer incorrect things to start with Csaba, then you don't have to give in later.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#18 User is offline   kayin801 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 14:14

1♣, this is a normal 1NT in the "BBO expert" world where your sole objective is to play every single hand.
I once yelled at my partner for discarding the 'wrong' card when he was subjected to a squeeze that I allowed by giving the wrong count with too high a card. Now he's allowed to pitch aces when the opponents have the king in the dummy. At trick 2. When he could have followed suit. And blame me.

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#19 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 14:18

 Phil, on 2010-November-17, 12:46, said:

8) Partner will trap pass a 2♦ overcall with HTxx of ♦. This is bad for us too.

Why is that bad? Partner passes, I make a takeout double, and they go loads down.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
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#20 User is offline   luke warm 

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Posted 2010-November-17, 17:12

as much as this pains me, i agree with richard this (one) time ;)
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