You are playing 2/1 GF with Riton, i.e. an opening of 2♥ shows 11-15 with 5+ hearts and 4+ clubs, whereas a rebid of 2♣ after a 1♥ opening shows 16-18 points, any distribution. You deal yourself:
♠- ♥AQJTxx ♦xxx ♣AQxx
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Riton opening problem
#1
Posted 2010-November-05, 18:10
"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
-- Bertrand Russell
-- Bertrand Russell
#2
Posted 2010-November-05, 18:19
Is that a trick question?
2♥ shows 11-15 with 5+ hearts and 4+ clubs,
I hold 11-15 (13) with 5+ (6) hearts and 4+ clubs.
Sometimes you actually hold a maximum....
2♥ shows 11-15 with 5+ hearts and 4+ clubs,
I hold 11-15 (13) with 5+ (6) hearts and 4+ clubs.
Sometimes you actually hold a maximum....
#3
Posted 2010-November-05, 19:53
hotShot, on 2010-November-05, 18:19, said:
Is that a trick question?
2♥ shows 11-15 with 5+ hearts and 4+ clubs,
I hold 11-15 (13) with 5+ (6) hearts and 4+ clubs.
Sometimes you actually hold a maximum....
2♥ shows 11-15 with 5+ hearts and 4+ clubs,
I hold 11-15 (13) with 5+ (6) hearts and 4+ clubs.
Sometimes you actually hold a maximum....
I agree with Hotshot. If you have a bid for the hand you hold, why not use it?
"The King of Hearts a broadsword bears, the Queen of Hearts a rose." W. H. Auden.
#4
Posted 2010-November-05, 20:01
If my clubs were AQJx I would treat that hand as in the 16-18 range. But as it is, I would open 2H.
- Andy -
We are all connected to each other biologically, to the Earth chemically, and to the rest of the universe atomically.
We're in the universe, and the universe is in us.
We are all connected to each other biologically, to the Earth chemically, and to the rest of the universe atomically.
We're in the universe, and the universe is in us.
#5
Posted 2010-November-08, 03:38
It's a nice hand, but if you play a system like this you just open 2♥ and cope with it. This is one of the reasons why I don't like such openings. If opps intervene you can still bid another number of ♥ on your own (or Dbl) to show your good offensive hand. That's a reason why I like such openings. (so I have mixed feelings
)
I didn't have a button to abstain from the second poll, so I just voted 2♥ without much thought.
![:rolleyes:](http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)
I didn't have a button to abstain from the second poll, so I just voted 2♥ without much thought.
"It may be rude to leave to go to the bathroom, but it's downright stupid to sit there and piss yourself" - blackshoe
#6
Posted 2010-November-11, 12:54
I confess I don't know Riton's methods that well. However, it seems like the 2♥ opening should show a hand that in standard bidding, would open 1♥, rebid 2♣, and pass partner's 2♥ correction. I believe that this hand fails on the last count (I would bid 3♥ after 1♥-1N-2♣-2♥). It's quite easy to construct hands where you'd miss a good game or slam after the 2♥ opening, which could be a much weaker offensive hand.
Playing Gazzilli, I can open 1♥ and rebid 2N to show a hand with 6♥-4m and about 5 losers, which seems a perfect description of this hand. Since Riton has removed the minimum ♥/♣ hand from consideration, it seems you should be better placed. How do you use 1♥-1N-2N? If you're really using the 2♣ rebid to show precisely 16-18 (rather than 16+) that seems mildly wasteful... one of the big advantages of this type of method is having a way to show good 6/4 and 5/5 hands that might miss a game or land in the wrong contract playing 2/1 (typically by getting passed in the second suit at the two-level).
Playing Gazzilli, I can open 1♥ and rebid 2N to show a hand with 6♥-4m and about 5 losers, which seems a perfect description of this hand. Since Riton has removed the minimum ♥/♣ hand from consideration, it seems you should be better placed. How do you use 1♥-1N-2N? If you're really using the 2♣ rebid to show precisely 16-18 (rather than 16+) that seems mildly wasteful... one of the big advantages of this type of method is having a way to show good 6/4 and 5/5 hands that might miss a game or land in the wrong contract playing 2/1 (typically by getting passed in the second suit at the two-level).
Adam W. Meyerson
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
#7
Posted 2010-November-11, 16:57
awm, on 2010-November-11, 12:54, said:
I confess I don't know Riton's methods that well. However, it seems like the 2♥ opening should show a hand that in standard bidding, would open 1♥, rebid 2♣, and pass partner's 2♥ correction. I believe that this hand fails on the last count (I would bid 3♥ after 1♥-1N-2♣-2♥). It's quite easy to construct hands where you'd miss a good game or slam after the 2♥ opening, which could be a much weaker offensive hand.
Playing Gazzilli, I can open 1♥ and rebid 2N to show a hand with 6♥-4m and about 5 losers, which seems a perfect description of this hand. Since Riton has removed the minimum ♥/♣ hand from consideration, it seems you should be better placed. How do you use 1♥-1N-2N? If you're really using the 2♣ rebid to show precisely 16-18 (rather than 16+) that seems mildly wasteful... one of the big advantages of this type of method is having a way to show good 6/4 and 5/5 hands that might miss a game or land in the wrong contract playing 2/1 (typically by getting passed in the second suit at the two-level).
Playing Gazzilli, I can open 1♥ and rebid 2N to show a hand with 6♥-4m and about 5 losers, which seems a perfect description of this hand. Since Riton has removed the minimum ♥/♣ hand from consideration, it seems you should be better placed. How do you use 1♥-1N-2N? If you're really using the 2♣ rebid to show precisely 16-18 (rather than 16+) that seems mildly wasteful... one of the big advantages of this type of method is having a way to show good 6/4 and 5/5 hands that might miss a game or land in the wrong contract playing 2/1 (typically by getting passed in the second suit at the two-level).
Currently, I have 1♥-1NT-2NT defined as showing 17-18(19) balanced, rebidding 2♣ only with unbalanced hands. Whether this makes sense is a good question.
I have indeed been thinking about this aspect of Riton vs. Gazzilli recently, and maybe jumping with intermediate hands and having the 2♣ rebid unlimited (well, up to a 2♣ opening) does make more sense. I'm quite open to arguments on this topic.
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"One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision"
-- Bertrand Russell
-- Bertrand Russell
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