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#1 User is online   jillybean 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 08:23

Scoring: MP

opps pass
1♣:2♠*
3♣:3♠
3n:4♣*
4n:?



2♠ is a SJS
4♣ is mini max gerber
4N is 2, maximum

What now and can you improve on the earlier sequence?
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly." MikeH
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#2 User is offline   pooltuna 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 08:27

jillybean, on Jul 11 2010, 09:23 AM, said:

Scoring: MP

opps pass
1♣:2♠*
3♣:3♠
3n:4♣*
4n:?



2♠ is a SJS
4♣ is mini max gerber
4N is 2, maximum

What now and can you improve on the earlier sequence?

maybe I'm losing my mind but in a SJS auction I thought the 3♠ call said "partner this is the trump suit start qbidding."
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#3 User is online   jillybean 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 08:51

Ok, then the auction would have been

1♣:2♠
3♣:3♠
4♣:4♦
4♥:5♣
5♦:?
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly." MikeH
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#4 User is offline   hanp 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 09:39

Given Jillybean's auction I would bid 7C.

Hate the agreements by the way but you knew that.
and the result can be plotted on a graph.
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#5 User is online   jillybean 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 09:51

hanp, on Jul 11 2010, 08:39 AM, said:

Given Jillybean's auction I would bid 7C.

Hate the agreements by the way but you knew that.

I know you hate mini max etc , do you play SJS?
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly." MikeH
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#6 User is offline   MarkDean 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 10:09

7NT for me. Seems likely we have 6 club tricks, 2 aces and 3 spades. Lots of places those two tricks could come: spades come in, partner has heart king, partner has diamond KQ.
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#7 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 12:27

yeah, seems like we got the tricks for 7NT. Gophermax!
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#8 User is offline   Siegmund 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 12:50

Given the Gerber auction, I ask for kings and bid 7NT if partner has any, 6NT if he doesn't.

I also think that 3S sets trump and calls for cuebids, in which case CA+HA+DK is again enough that I take a shot at 7NT. (Three cheers for continuing to cuebid at the 5-level... a vastly more powerful approach than switching horses in midstream and changing to blackwood after 4-level cuebids.)
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#9 User is offline   mike777 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 20:48

jillybean, on Jul 11 2010, 09:23 AM, said:

Scoring: MP

opps pass
1♣:2♠*
3♣:3♠
3n:4♣*
4n:?



2♠ is a SJS
4♣ is mini max gerber
4N is 2, maximum

What now and can you improve on the earlier sequence?

prefer 4c or really 4d kickback over 3c if you play that per otherposts I think...:)
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#10 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 21:39

7N. I would feel very unlucky if 7♣ made and this didn't.

Maybe we aren't supposed to bid this....
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#11 User is offline   JLOGIC 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 21:45

Phil, on Jul 11 2010, 10:39 PM, said:

7N. I would feel very unlucky if 7♣ made and this didn't.

Maybe we aren't supposed to bid this....

Well we know partner has a stiff spade at most, 6 clubs, 2 aces, and a minimum hand. We have the ability to ask for kings, so by bidding 7N without asking for kings you're implying that you're happy to be in it opposite no kings (else you would ask).

So that gives partner something like:

x Axx Qxx AJ9xxx

That layout needs spades to run, where 7C always makes without spades splitting on a non inspired diamond lead.

Why would this be such an unlucky layout? It just seems completely terrible/careless to bid 7N if partner has no kings. Why do we need to gamble?
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#12 User is offline   JLOGIC 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 21:47

Gerber might get a bad rap but ask for kings and bid 7N opposite a king and 7C opposite no kings imo. Conventions that ask for aces and kings are good not bad!
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#13 User is online   jillybean 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 22:35

mike777, on Jul 11 2010, 07:48 PM, said:

jillybean, on Jul 11 2010, 09:23 AM, said:

Scoring: MP

opps pass
1♣:2♠*
3♣:3♠
3n:4♣*
4n:?



2♠ is a SJS
4♣ is mini max gerber
4N is 2, maximum

What now and can you improve on the earlier sequence?

prefer 4c or really 4d kickback over 3c if you play that per otherposts I think...:(

I dont want to describe my hand as a 2 suiter and I haven't given up on my ♠'s yet :)
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly." MikeH
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#14 User is online   jillybean 

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Posted 2010-July-11, 22:41

Here's the full hand, making 7

Scoring: MP

1♣:2♠*
3♣:3♠
3N:4♣*
4N*:6N

"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly." MikeH
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#15 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2010-July-12, 05:49

hope you don't take it personally but it looks to me like you chickened out on this deal. you know you are not off an ace, so you should think about grand and where the possible tricks can come from. I think if you think about the way play is going to go, it is not very hard to see that 7C is a favourite to make even if partner has no kings. you can set up spades and enjoy them opposite just about any holding in partner's hand.
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#16 User is offline   gnasher 

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Posted 2010-July-12, 07:09

What gwnn says seems right, but your partner also underbid. 3NT is very feeble.
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#17 User is offline   bid_em_up 

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Posted 2010-July-12, 07:14

..
Is the word "pass" not in your vocabulary?
So many experts, not enough X cards.
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#18 User is online   jillybean 

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Posted 2010-July-12, 07:33

Yes, I did stop short. I wasn't clear on how to ask for Kings here and I'm still not sure.
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly." MikeH
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#19 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2010-July-12, 07:38

if you play Gerber, 4♣ then 5♣ is asking for kings

Anyway, my point was that if you don't know how to ask for kings, you should bid 7♣, not 6NT. 7♣ should be a good contract and it's not hard to see why.
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#20 User is offline   Bbradley62 

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Posted 2010-July-12, 08:09

Is it really possible that your partner has a max with no K?
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