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Is 2 diamonds forcing?

#1 User is offline   dickiegera 

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Posted 2010-July-07, 17:47

Bidding goes:

1♥ -P- 1♠-2♣
x* - P - 2♦ - P
?

*support double

Is 2♦ Forcing?
Thank you
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#2 User is offline   jdonn 

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Posted 2010-July-07, 17:59

No, but this is the type of follow up auction that it's very good to discuss before playing support doubles. As good as I think they are, they are probably the convention of which people are most guilty of failing to discuss style and follow ups.
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
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#3 User is offline   cloa513 

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Posted 2010-July-07, 18:56

Generally that say a lot of diamonds 5+ and 4 spades and not three hearts and not many high card points. If you want to sure to force 3C is available.
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#4 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2010-July-07, 19:24

Nope.
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#5 User is offline   neilkaz 

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Posted 2010-July-07, 20:10

cloa513, on Jul 7 2010, 07:56 PM, said:

Generally that say a lot of diamonds 5+ and 4 spades and not three hearts and not many high card points. If you want to sure to force 3C is available.

We agree. If opener is minimum it is simply an attempt to improve upon playing 2♠ in a 4-3 fit.
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#6 User is offline   Free 

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Posted 2010-July-08, 02:10

NF
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#7 User is offline   Flame 

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Posted 2010-July-08, 05:14

With 5♠4♦ hands, no matter how strong there is no real need for bidding 2♦, you know of 8 spade fit.
So it more logical to use it for 5♦4♠, now with this distribution and GF you will begin with 2♦ over 1♠, so it cant be GF, it also cant be too weak since you would have bid 2S, so it should be somewhere in between and should therefore be constructive but not forcing.
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#8 User is offline   whereagles 

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Posted 2010-July-08, 08:07

agree to the weak 5♦4♠ canape-ish interpretation. Really, I don't see what else it can logically be.
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#9 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2010-July-08, 08:46

whereagles, on Jul 8 2010, 02:07 PM, said:

agree to the weak 5♦4♠ canape-ish interpretation. Really, I don't see what else it can logically be.

-pick a major partscore (2-4 in the majors)
-mild game try with 5♠ and 5♦
-pick a partscore with 4♠ and 4♦


Not that I'd play any of these but I know several popular treatments (of other auctions) that are inferior to all these
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#10 User is offline   peachy 

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Posted 2010-July-08, 11:44

Not forcing. Just a cheap way to try to find our best partscore fit, responder has only 4-card spades and probably 5+ diamonds.
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#11 User is offline   Cascade 

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Posted 2010-July-08, 14:30

I am not an expert on support doubles but I can't see how a minimum bid when we have so far promised only minimum values and partner has essentially forced us to make another bid can be anything other than nonforcing.
Wayne Burrows

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#12 User is offline   Gerben42 

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Posted 2010-July-08, 14:40

Agree with Wayne. I would expect something like

♠Kxxx
♥xx
♦Axxxx
♣xx
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#13 User is offline   FrancesHinden 

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Posted 2010-July-10, 03:44

How about this auction:

1♦ - pass - 1♥ - 2♣
Dbl* - pass - 2♠

* support

Is 2♠ forcing or not? It has to show at least invitational values, but can opener pass on a minimum 3352 or 4342?

(we saw Meckwell disagree about this sequence on vugraph a while back)
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