[twcho]

I am playing 2/1 with Reverse Bergen Raise. The follow up after 1M-2NT is somewhat standard (I suppose): 3 level new suit is singleton/void, 4 level new suit is 5 card second suit. 3M is good hand while 4M is minimum sign off.

But the above structure is far from satisfactory. May someone recommend some better scheme after that?

Many thanks.

[pooltuna]

twcho, on Jun 16 2010, 09:45 PM, said:

I am playing 2/1 with Reverse Bergen Raise. The follow up after 1M-2NT is somewhat standard (I suppose): 3 level new suit is singleton/void, 4 level new suit is 5 card second suit. 3M is good hand while 4M is minimum sign off.

But the above structure is far from satisfactory. May someone recommend some better scheme after that?

Many thanks.

no suggestions but sure that you'll get plenty. Be sure you integrate your splinter structure into whatever you decide to use.

[blackshoe]

IIRC, the complete Bergen Raise structure includes:

3OM (other major): splinter in some suit
3NT: balanced (4333) game raise
4C/4D: other raises, not sure, I'd have to look it up. Hardy uses these as trump Swiss. 4C shows a 4 card balanced game raise (12-15 or so) with good trumps and 4D shows the same shape and range, but bad trumps.

Both Hardy and, as I recall, Bergen, suggest Jacoby 2NT should not be used on a minimum balanced hand. So the range starts with a good 15 or so.

There are structures wherein 3C irt 2NT shows any minimum opener, but I don't remember what the other stuff shows, as I don't play that. I'm sure somebody else who does will chime in though. :-)

[andy_h]

http://forums.bridge...topic=29118&hl=

[Free]

A very simple adjustment which makes this structure a lot better: NEVER bid 4M! Bid 3M with all hands that don't fit elsewhere, and figure out with serious/frivolous 3NT if you should go to slam.

Next step might be to swap 3♣ and 3M, so you stay lower and responder can ask/show more.

[ONEferBRID]

Regarding Reverse Bergen.... ( I don't recommend it )...
That means you have absolutely NO gametry available after:
1H - 3D! ( if it is a constructive raise ).

Yes, I know someone told you that you have more "room" for slam exploration
using Rev Bergen, but you have many more gametry hands than slamtrys.

[Free]

ONEferBRID, on Jun 17 2010, 02:26 PM, said:

Regarding Reverse Bergen.... ( I don't recommend it )...
That means you have absolutely NO gametry available after:
1H - 3D! ( if it is a constructive raise ).

Yes, I know someone told you that you have more "room" for slam exploration
using Rev Bergen, but you have many more gametry hands than slamtrys.

Just change the ranges... 3♣ as 8-11, and 3♦ as 6-7.

[ONEferBRID]

Free, on Jun 17 2010, 08:50 AM, said:

ONEferBRID, on Jun 17 2010, 02:26 PM, said:

Regarding Reverse Bergen.... ( I don't recommend it )...
That means you have absolutely NO gametry available after:
1H - 3D! ( if it is a constructive raise ).

Yes, I know someone told you that you have more "room" for slam exploration
using Rev Bergen, but you have many more gametry hands than slamtrys.

Just change the ranges... 3♣ as 8-11, and 3♦ as 6-7.

I've also seen a suggestion ( by Kleinman ? ) to play 3C! as an "either/or" :

1M -  3C! = either 7-8 or 11-12 and

1M -  3D! = 9 - 10

[fromageGB]

Back to the point :

What I now like to play after Jacoby 2NT (or Jacoby 2♠ over 1♥) is predicated by the fact that my splinters are limited to hands with high card strength less than that normally associated with game force support. So the Jacoby 2♠/2NT can be any hand with 4 card support and 13+ with no top limit, and may include a shortage.

Consequently, the replies are to bid the next step if opener has no shortage (relay), and bid the shortage suit if there is one, but if the shortage suit is the one above trumps (this is the relay suit) then this is shown by bidding 3M.

In response to the relay, responder shows his shortage if he has one, with exactly the same bids.

After a shortage has been shown, or if responder has no shortage either he bids the same, the next bid is above 3M. With a hand with no particular extras, such as opener with a flattish 12-14, the bid is "non-serious" 3NT. Bypassing this is a "serious" cue bid (1st or 2nd round control) and the other hand is obliged to cue bid if he has a control. The serious cue bidder can then happily bid 4M knowing partner knows he is serious and will go on if appropriate.

Of course after a "non-serious" 3NT partner may simply bid game, or may cue bid himself if strong.

Summary
(1) Opener shows a shortage...
(2) or responder shows a shortage...
(3) "Non-serious 3NT" or (serious) cue bidding sequence
(4) Ace ask if no suit wide open, and the seriousness (taking any shortage into account) justifies it.

In common with other treatments, when hearts are trumps we play a "non-serious 3♠", with 3NT being a cue bid in spades.

[gwnn]

http://forums.bridge...showtopic=38288

try the jdonn structure, it's great. I have never tried it but it's great.

[gnasher]

There are two things I dislike having to do after a Jacoby-type raise:
(1) Jump to game with a normal minimum
(2) Describe my hand to the opponents when we can't possibly have a slam on, and when game may not be cold.

I usually play something like:
3♣ = any minimum
3♦ = non-minimum, no shortage
3♥/♠/NT = non-minimum, short ♣/♦/OM
4 new = 5-5

Over 3♣, responder can:
- Bid game
- Ask for shortage with 3♦
- Show his own shortage (so that you get a second level of splinters).

Similarly, over 3♦:
- 3♥ asks for shape (using some scheme that seems to be different in each partnership that I play in)
- Higher bids show shortage

[whereagles]

gnasher's scheme is a good one. (belive it's similar to Martel/Stansby's one). You'll have difficulties with certain hands, but bid to good slams on the rest.