[TD1995]

Hi all:
2♦ means weak in SAYC. But many people think this doesn't work well. They suggest that 2♦ means have at least 5-4 majors. And in Precision, that means 4-4-1-4 or 4-4-0-5 and 11-15HCP. Which is better? I'm new in Bridge. (Sorry, I'm Chinese, my English isn't very well)

[zasanya]

2 Diamond weak works well for many others.If you want to really change to something else then try multi 2D with its many varieties (weak 2 major +some other strong possibilities if you want) provided it is allowed in the place where you play.Refer www.bridgeguys.com/pdf/UltimateClub/2DPree.pdf

[CSGibson]

Frankly, it depends on your system; a bid like 2♦ mini-roman (the hand with short diamonds), or Flannery (4 spades and 5 hearts), should solve a problem that the rest of your system has a hard time with.

If you think that hands with 4 spades and 5 hearts are not a problem for your system, it makes no sense to use Flannery. Similarly, Mini-roman bids are most frequently a part of a precision system that employs 5 card major suit openings, so that it takes some of the burden off of 1 diamond openings. In a 2/1 or sayc system, however, mini-roman makes less sense, because you have the ability to open 1 club with those hands and let responder make natural follow-up bids.

[helene_t]

In Standard American, a natural weak 2♦ is fine since you don't really need the bid for anything else.

In Precision, you need a way to show the 3-suited hands with short diamonds. You can use 2♦ for that.

So it really depends on your system.

[Fluffy]

yeah find a hole in your system, in mine I have the 22-23 balanced hole, so I use it for that purpose, on a multi way with a weak 2 suiter in both majors.

[Free]

The opening in precision is used to fix a problem hand. You don't want to open 1♦ on a singleton, you don't want to open 1M on a 4 card, you don't want to open 2♣ on a 4 card, and you don't want to open 1NT with singeltons, so you need another solution => 2♦

In natural systems like sayc there are no similar problems, so standard a 2♦ opening is used as a weak two. This doesn't mean you can't change this. There are a huge amount of possibilities for 2♦: you may want to use it for something more frequent (like weak with both Majors, multi, Wilkosz, rough two,...), you may want to use it to fix a whole in your system or give your constructive system more options (like 18-19 balanced, Flannery,...).

You can't just say "A is better than B" without knowing what you play, and what you want.

[gwnn]

if it's good enough for Helgemo, it's good enough for me.

@ Fluffy: sounds like your hole in your system is the 18-19 balanced hand because you rebid 2NT on very weird hands.

[gszeszycki]

my personal favorite is 1444 0454 0445 short SPADES and 12 15 my main purpose
behind this is to make me feel a whole lot better whenever bidding goes
1d 1s 2c 2h fsf it eliminates missing 44 (or rarely 54 heart fits when responder was weak and had to p 2c or bid 2d) and doesnt force responder to consider bidding 1h over 1d with 5s 4-5h and a weak hand (an idea i inherently dislike anyway)---- just because they are afraid of hands just like the ones my 2d bid shows).

[gwnn]

funny one gszeszycki. will try it some day.

[gwnn]

also 2D as 44 or better in majors is really fun to play, it doesn't help with your system at all and sometimes you will play 2Mx in a 4-3 fit for no good reason, but it's a lot of fun and opps will go for a lot of inordinately large numbers for no good reason too.

but it's illegal in America. if you said that this was a destructive convention, I would not really argue with that.

[jjbrr]

If you're new in Bridge, weak 2♦ is a perfectly acceptable treatment and the one I recommend.

It's a huge, huge error to overload yourself with conventions until you have more experience.

[hanp]

yeah if you are new, just play weak 2's or multi. Keep it simple.

[mikeh]

jjbrr, on Jun 16 2010, 10:16 AM, said:

If you're new in Bridge, weak 2♦ is a perfectly acceptable treatment and the one I recommend.

It's a huge, huge error to overload yourself with conventions until you have more experience.

good advice

[pooltuna]

jjbrr, on Jun 16 2010, 10:16 AM, said:

If you're new in Bridge, weak 2♦ is a perfectly acceptable treatment and the one I recommend.

It's a huge, huge error to overload yourself with conventions until you have more experience.

What!!!!! This is like taking 1 Spanish (English, French, Swahili, pick the language of your choice) lesson after that you speak fluently right I mean the French have often commented on American's French-speaking ability

[Siegmund]

Wilkosz ftw. Such a good convention people are afraid of it and ban it (Seriously, don't know why people are so afraid of it.)

In the real world, for OP - very few people have a reason to play anything other than natural and weak, unless and until they acquire a taste for odd gadgetry.

[rbforster]

Wilkosz (weak two strength, showing 5/5+ with at least one major),
Jammer (weak two strength, 3-suited with at least 4/4/3 shape in any 3 suits)

or you can just play it as 6 diamonds weak, but that would be boring.

[whereagles]

2♦ weak > all
2♣ weak >> all

nuff said