[Little Kid]

Scoring: MP

Pass-(Pass)-1♣ - (X)
XX - (Pass)-Pass-(1♥)
1♠ - (Pass)-?

---

- Does 1♠ show 5♠?
- Is 2♣ forcing?
- What do you bid?

[helene_t]

No, with five p would probably not have redoubled

No.

2♣. Or maybe pass. P is a passed hand after all.

[xcurt]

2c is a huge underbid at this point. I bid 2h now. I dont know what 1s shows but we have lots of space

[Winstonm]

Partner could not open the bidding, could not bid 1S over the double, and cannot double 1H. That pretty much leaves a 4342 pattern or 4333 or 4351, while we have all of our cards over the double and outside of hearts.

I kind of like a 3H bid here. I will raise 4C or 4D to game, bid 4C over 3S, and I will pass 3NT or 4S.

[CSGibson]

Winstonm, on May 8 2010, 06:14 PM, said:

Partner could not open the bidding, could not bid 1S over the double, and cannot double 1H. That pretty much leaves a 4342 pattern or 4333 or 4351, while we have all of our cards over the double and outside of hearts.

I kind of like a 3H bid here. I will raise 4C or 4D to game, bid 4C over 3S, and I will pass 3NT or 4S.

The doubler is sitting over us.

[rant] As for the auction, it should not exist in my mind, as redoubling 1 club, ostensibly looking for a penalty, is a very flawed tactic. Sure, you may be prepared to double 2 spots, but they inevitably land in the 3rd when you give them so much room to explore or preempt, and you lose tempo on your own auction. Just bid your spades initially. [/rant]

[Winstonm]

Quote

The doubler is sitting over us

D'oh!!!

[aguahombre]

agree with GSgibson's rant. passed hand should bid whatever they would normally bid if pard opened 1C....Give opener a break.

[the hog]

aguahombre, on May 9 2010, 09:00 AM, said:

agree with GSgibson's rant. passed hand should bid whatever they would normally bid if pard openend 1C....Give opener a break.

Also agree. The xx appears to be a very overused bid.

[gwnn]

no of course not. partner should FINALLY bid his 5card spade suit if he has one.

no of course not. we stopped trying to penalise them, we're looking for a nice parking spot.

I bid 2♣ but I'd like to have better agreements on what 2♠ really means here.

[aguahombre]

at the risk of repeating. we let a double of a minor interfere with our auction, when it took up no space. Whatever happens now, we deserve it.

[andy_h]

I think 1♠ shows 5, typically with 5143. Hands with 4♠ can pass first and decide what to do (pass or remove) when partner makes a penalty double with examples such as 42(34) or 4144 or 4153 etc. By not giving partner a chance to double 1♥ should show one's own suit and hence a five card suit. This is in conjunction with the auction of P-P-1♣-X; XX-P-P-1♥; P-P-1♠ being a 4 card suit.

[pooltuna]

Little Kid, on May 8 2010, 05:08 PM, said:

Scoring: MP

Pass-(Pass)-1♣ - (X)
XX - (Pass)-Pass-(1♥)
1♠ - (Pass)-?

---

- Does 1♠ show 5♠?
- Is 2♣ forcing?
- What do you bid?

question 1] Not sure don't care since 2♠ will be our best shot for game

queston 2] no

question 3] see answer to question 1

[billw55]

hmm partner is a passed hand. Can I just pass 1♠?

[Cyberyeti]

If you redouble with a passed hand and 5 spades you're very short in clubs, AJxxx, J10xx, K98x, void would be the sort of hand I'd expect where you don't really want to have a crack at 1H, but might have a go at 1S or 1D. AJxxx, xxx, KQxx, x is also not impossible.

In the style that I normally play (with a weak no trump and a natural club, so I don't have the issue of having <5 clubs and a 12 count and having opened 1C unless precisely 4414), passing 1Cxx shows a better hand than bidding, so passing then bidding 2C or 2S shows this sort of values but I presume this is not the case here.

I think I would bid 2S anyway.

[xcurt]

Cyberyeti, on May 9 2010, 03:51 PM, said:

If you redouble with a passed hand and 5 spades you're very short in clubs, AJxxx, J10xx, K98x, void would be the sort of hand I'd expect where you don't really want to have a crack at 1H, but might have a go at 1S or 1D. AJxxx, xxx, KQxx, x is also not impossible.

In the style that I normally play (with a weak no trump and a natural club, so I don't have the issue of having <5 clubs and a 12 count and having opened 1C unless precisely 4414), passing 1Cxx shows a better hand than bidding, so passing then bidding 2C or 2S shows this sort of values but I presume this is not the case here.

I think I would bid 2S anyway.

game is a huge favorite with both your example hands. im still bidding 2h.

why is everyone so pessimistic. we could have a random 11 here. instead we have 13 but ajt is so undervalued by hcp and we have two of those and another working ten. and we are short in their suit and paetner is a favorite to hold 4 hearts ( no enemy lawful competition to 2 lvl ) yet didnt crack so we are unlikely to have wastage in his hand either.

[655321]

I have no idea what partner has, but I agree with xcurt in that basically we want to be in game.

Unless partner has only 4 spades and is also short in clubs, game is surely almost always cold. If he is 4441, 4351, etc and bid this way for some reason, 4♠ is likely to be a reasonable game anyway.