[masse24]

Neither Vulnerable

Though I am a relatively new bridge player, my partner is even more so. Hence this laughable bidding sequence below. Just prior to sitting down together we discussed responses to a strong 2 Club opening. We agreed that a positive response in a suit required a minimum of 5 cards and 2 of the top 3 honors...or 3 of the top 5.


I dealt and picked up this:
♠AK
♥AK4
♣KQT98754

Here is the bidding:
2♣ P 2♥ P
3♣ P 3♦ P
4♣ P 4♥ P
6♥ P P P

I had assumed that my partner had at least 5 hearts headed by QJT since I had the top two honors. When he rebid them I assumed he was void in clubs with the same 5 hearts he had originally mentioned or possibly 6.

Partners hand:
♠xxx
♥Qxxx
♦KQxx
♣Ax


I remember thinking to myself when I bid 6 hearts..."Never lay an 8 card suit down in dummy unless it is trump".

Obviously some miscommunication.

Apparently I should have insisted on Clubs?!
After getting a good laugh at this bidding fiasco ...tell me how to bid it.

Does partner bid some level of NT as his first response with 11HCP?
Do I jump to 4 clubs or 5?
How do we reach the cold grand in clubs?

[pooltuna]

Your partner violated an important agreement and consequently created a sense of mistrust in similar auctions in the future. my personal meta agreement is no positive responses in 4 card suits and for the minors it takes a 6 card suit or outstanding top cards in a 5 card suit. you never mentioned all your agreements in 2♣ auctions but presumably 2♦ would have been waiting and probably is your best choice for proceeding altho some agreements for the meaning of 2 and 3 NT could be reached. Certainly if I made an agreement for 3NT one condition would be slam forcing.

[helene_t]

You were right in assuming that p had at least QJTxx of hearts for his 2♥ bid. If 4♥ is natural (you can see it can't be a cuebid) he should have at least QJxxxx.

6♥ is a good choice, then. If one opp has ♣AJx you can't make 6♣, but 6♥ still has good chances.

[neilkaz]

Once your pard has butchered the action by giving a positive response on Qxxx (and all the worse after you two discussed and agreed to a rather standard meaning for a positive response your auction may be in trouble anyhow.

Keep the bidding LOW with good hands when allready in a game force and when slam is a good possibility ! (ie after a positive response to 2♣). I cannot stress this enough.

There's a case for supporting ♥ with your 3rd call rather than rebidding ♣ and this case is made all the stronger since it seems you had serious thoughts about playing in ♥.

PD's 3rd call of 4♥ is simply too bad for words. Why he rebid a poor 4 card and so far unsupported suit is beyond me.

Over his 4♥ keep the bidding low as you have no idea if you can make a grand or not, IMHO. I'd cue bid 4♠. (If you ask for aces or key cards (assuming 4NT would be for ♥) you'll have no idea which minor suit ace pd holds if he has only 1.

I'd have some strong words with PD about not only his 1st ♥ bid (perhaps he felt with 11 pts he had to make a strong positive response no matter what?) but clearly about his sickening 4♥ rebid.

// neilkaz //

[masse24]

Thanks for your replies.

I do know that partner really messed up our "agreed" system on how to respond to a strong artificial 2 Club bid. He had never played it before and, even though discussed, he forgot.

My question remains, how should it have been bid?

After more thought I was thinking this might work:

2♣ P 3NT* P
6♣ P 7♣** P
P P

*Partner's 3NT showing 10-12 HCP with no biddable 5 card suit. Balanced to Semi-balanced. (This of course would have to be by partnership agreement)

6 Clubs a bit of a risk but with partner's 3NT bid I'm almost guaranteed 2 clubs in his hand, giving me 10 total. Opposite my 6 Club bid without the Ace partner has no problem bidding the grand...

I think the real key is partner's first bid in response to 2 Clubs and our mutual understanding of its meaning.

Any thoughts? Thanks!

[helene_t]

One possible start is
2♣-2♦
3♣-4♣
Note that your 3♣ bid shows at least 6. This means that with a 5431 shape with longer minor you would have either to rebid 2NT or open at the 1-level.

Responder would like to have more than doubleton support for his 4♣ bid but I don't see any alternative.

How it proceeds now depends on your cuebidding style and keycard-asking conventions. Maybe you can show your void if responder asks keycards, or in some other way. Otherwise you will end up in 6♣. If you can bid 6♣ without any misunderstandings I think your slam bidding is adequate, bidding 7♣ requires some advanced techniques.

Alternatively,
2♣-2NT
4♣-
and the same applies as above w.r.t. followups. Note the opener must bid 4♣ to set trumps since 3♣ would be Stayman. I would say that stayman applies while transfers do not. Make sure to discuss these things (so that he doesn't think 4♣ is Gerber) if you want to play a positive 2NT response.

With an unknown p I would certainly respond 2♦ since I wouldn't expect him to guess which follow-ups I assume after a 2NT response.

[P_Marlowe]

#1 Assuming you play something similar to SA, your partner should
respond with 2D instead of 2H
If 2D is basically at most 7HCP, he has to find a bid, and 2H is fine,
although if you play a 5 card major system, I would suggest 2NT.
#2 4C should set trumps, which means 4H is a cue bid.
Obviously both both of disagreed with this statement.
#3 Before you ask, how to reach 7C, ask how to reach 6C.
And this means, you should first have a discussion, what the answers
to a 2C bid are.
With kind regards
Marlowe

[helene_t]

P_Marlowe, on Nov 26 2009, 12:53 PM, said:

If 2D is basically at most 7HCP, he has to find a bid, and 2H is fine,
    although if you play a 5 card major system, I would suggest 2NT.

No, 2♥ shows at least five hearts, regardless of whether you play 4-card majors or 5-card majors.

If this hand has to make a natural positive response, the only option is 2NT.

[P_Marlowe]

masse24, on Nov 26 2009, 12:16 AM, said:

Thanks for your replies.

I do know that partner really messed up our "agreed" system on how to respond to a strong artificial 2 Club bid. He had never played it before and, even though discussed, he forgot.

My question remains, how should it have been bid?

After more thought I was thinking this might work:

2♣ P 3NT* P
6♣ P 7♣** P
P P

*Partner's 3NT showing 10-12 HCP with no biddable 5 card suit. Balanced to Semi-balanced. (This of course would have to be by partnership agreement)

6 Clubs a bit of a risk but with partner's 3NT bid I'm almost guaranteed 2 clubs in his hand, giving me 10 total. Opposite my 6 Club bid without the Ace partner has no problem bidding the grand...

I think the real key is partner's first bid in response to 2 Clubs and our mutual understanding of its meaning.

Any thoughts? Thanks!

4C instead of 6C.

6C should end the auction, sry - 7C is just ..., the guy who knowes
the least about the combined strength, makes the final decision,
remove the small heart, make it a small diamond, do you still want
to be in 7C?.

4C after 3NT sets trumps, and it is certainly not a weak bid, it
asks for cues, p will show the diamond control, which means opener
will know, that there is wastage in diamonds.

It becomes messy ...

Most likely I would end up in 6C.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[dicklont]

A normal sequence:
2♣ - 2♦
3♣ - 4♣ (show support: Ax is valuable)
4♦ (cue) - 5♣ (nothing to cue)
6♣ (after partners positive 4♣ this has chances)

Add some science
2♣ - 2♦
3♣ - 4♣
5♦ (Exclusion Blackwood) - 5♠ (one keycard)
6♣ (100% certain, you might wanna try 7 hoping partner can cover ♥x)

Science combined with foolishness
2♣ - 2♥ (a terrible call, but it would work)
3♣ - 4♣
5♦ (Exclusion Blackwood) - 5♠ (one keycard)
7♣ (100%, partner must have ♥Q for his first call)