[mtvesuvius]

One of my partners and I were looking into learning a forcing pass system, but I couldn't find any good notes on it... I was wondering if anybody had a full set of system notes, or knew a link to some on forcing pass. Preferably SPAM, but anything will do... Thanks.

[Gerben42]

Some ideas (good and bad) are on My Webpage to play around with.

Tuebingen Pass is based on a natural system with the Pass either being weak or strong. It does not work TOO well in competition, unfortunately.

"Magic Pass" which is basically Magic ♦ with a tweak and DOES work well. In addition it is simple to learn. Relay Strong Pass is probably not worth it because you cannot play it often enough.

Have fun!

[rbforster]

Regression - a forcing pass relay system. I find the webpage confusing but the system interesting. It seems to do a good job of putting the extra relay space (relative to a strong club) to good use with varying degrees of stopper asks, etc.

[akhare]

Here's a outline of the version that I (foobar) play with DrTodd. It's very similar to Moscito (with 2 under transfer openings though) and symmetric relays.

http://www.geocities...13/dejeuner.doc

IMO, one of the improvements is that 1N shouldn't be so restrictive (presently no 4CM unless 4333) and it can be easily accomplished by tweaking the 1N scheme.

PM if you want more details...

[Wackojack]

Here is the intro copied from a ms word document. I have had some fun playing it in the past. (Yes it has its weaknesses) I could sent you the complete document or put you in touch with the author if you are interested


The Forcing Pass Keith Henson, 27 Oct 04
Aggressive & constructive. Opens nearly all 8+ point hands.
The Forcing Pass is a competitive bidding system designed for contested auctions. The best way to compete is to open first as often as possible & bid fast to your limit. This system achieves this by opening descriptively hands with 8-12 points (the most common range, accounting for almost half of all hands) and enabling immediate pre-emptive responses. The system also allows slow & constructive auctions with strong hands in an uncontested auction, for the accurate bidding of close games and slams.

The key innovation of the system (created in 1974) is opening “Pass” with 0-7 or 17+. You open 1NT with a 13-16 NT hand & 1C with other 13-16 point hands (‘suited’). This releases all other openings to show 8-12 hands. 1D declares an 8-12 NT hand, and the rest (1H/S, all 2 & 3 level bids) accurately describe 8-12 point suited hands.

Openings page frequency %

Pass = 0-7 or 17+, forcing. (A few 8-point hands may be passed*) 6 30 (22+8)

1C = 13-16 and a suited hand (all shapes not in 1NT below) 5 12

1D = 8-12 NT (4432, 4333, minor 5332, poor minor 5422**) 2 20
1H/S = 8-12, 5+ cards in major bid, or 4-carder and 4441* 3 16 (8x2)

1NT = 13-16 NT (usually 4432, 4333, minor 5332) # 3 8

2C/D = 8-12, 5+ cards in minor bid (5-4** or 6+ minor) 4 10 (5x2)
2H/S/NT = 8-12, 5-5+ in suit bid & another (2NT = both minors) 4 2 (1+.7+.3)
3+suit = normal pre-empt

[Free]

Didn't know it was still up...

http://www.geocities...erick_staelens/

[mtvesuvius]

We played a Magic Pass yesterday, and it was quite fun! Maybe I'll post a hand or two of them... The only thing is that I felt that I should provide some sort of defense for the opponents to use, when I googled it I couldn't find any! Does anybody have any links to a defense, or defenses to a magic pass system?

[rbforster]

Some people I know play a very simple forcing pass system -

P 12+
1C 8-11
1D+ 0-7 suction-style ferts (so 1D is hearts or blacks, weak, etc)

Higher preempts were just more distributional and still suction (including NT openings). The "4th suit", impossible among the suction combinations, was the asking bid with an invitational+ hand.

They also used TOSR style relays throughout. For example,

Pass - ?

1C any semipositive response (then 1D is the GF ask, continuing with 1H+ as below)
1D any double negative response (1H Kokish, others nat NF)
1H+ TOSR positives

1C-?

1D GF relay (then TOSR relays)
1H Kokish (hearts or 13-15 NT)
1S+ natural NF

Very simple and symmetric.

[shevek]

Hi,

Here's a link to our crappy home page.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/scamp/
click on Scamp to see Spam summary &/or email me for a 6 page pdf.

I'm guessing you saw us playing it on BBO on Friday for 24 bds against Hanlon-McGann

Nick

[Gerben42]

Defense to Magic Pass:

Pass (9-11 bal. or something strong): Defend as Polish ♣, 1♣ bid is Dbl of Polish ♣.

1♣ 13 - 16 any shape: Defend as Polish ♣

1♦ Fert: Dbl = Semibalanced or strong, 12+. 2♣ and 2♦ overcall natural opening bids (11 - 16)

Rest of the opening bids show the bid suit in some constellation and don't need much special.

So in a way this system is "mostly harmless", but you get to bid alot!

[y66]

Quote

I'm guessing you saw us playing it on BBO on Friday for 24 bds against Hanlon-McGann

I saw that set. Really enjoyed it. Was rooting for you guys. First time I ever kibbed Hanlon-McGann and did not root for them. First time seeing forcing pass too.

[mtvesuvius]

shevek, on Mar 8 2009, 03:56 PM, said:

Hi,

Here's a link to our crappy home page.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/scamp/
click on Scamp to see Spam summary &/or email me for a 6 page pdf.

I'm guessing you saw us playing it on BBO on Friday for 24 bds against Hanlon-McGann

Nick

I did, and I enjoyed it a lot. It was great to see Forcing Pass in action!

Also, I'd love to know the details of SPAM

[shevek]

mtvesuvius, on Mar 8 2009, 10:23 PM, said:

shevek, on Mar 8 2009, 03:56 PM, said:

Hi,

Here's a link to our crappy home page.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/scamp/
click on Scamp to see Spam summary &/or email me for a 6 page pdf.

I'm guessing you saw us playing it on BBO on Friday for 24 bds against Hanlon-McGann

Nick

I did, and I enjoyed it a lot. It was great to see Forcing Pass in action!

Also, I'd love to know the details of SPAM

i'm nhughes@bigpond.net.au

pity we saved our bad stuff for vugraph. such as my unfavourable 2♦ on
♠Kx  ♥JT7xxx  ♦Jxx  ♣xx