[dbsboy]

Partner opens 2D, showing a 11-15 3415 / 4315 / 4414 / 4405

Holding

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What will your respond?

I realize there may be game, but i dont know what to bid.

2H / 2S / 3C = Signoff

while 2NT = Min-Max relay (answer: 3C=min, 3D=4405, 3H/3S=Max 4 Card Major, 3N=Max 4414)

3D=invite with 44Majors, 3M=Light Invite


Partner indeed has

---

so game looks good

Second Question: This is the response structure i am currently playing. Simple enough, but i am not sure if it is a nice one.

[hrothgar]

dbsboy, on Dec 11 2008, 04:22 PM, said:

Partner opens 2D, showing a 11-15  3415 / 4315 / 4414 / 4405

Holding

Dealer: ????? Vul: ???? Scoring: Unknown

♠ AQ2 ♥ Q64 ♦ QJT7 ♣ 963

What will your respond?

I realize there may be game, but i dont know what to bid.

This is an ugly hand for this set of methods.

I don't think that I can intelligently explore strain or level. I suspect that my best course of action is to bid 2♥ and provide the opponents with as much room as possible to overcall.

I will gleefully start doubling the opponents where ever they might go...

[gwnn]

2♥. I personally don't worry about game on this hand. I do have QJTx opposite x or - after all... If hearts were, say, Kxx, I would still bid 2♥ but would be much less content about it.

The relay structure looks fine to me...

[csdenmark]

I go for 2NT.

3♣ will be safe heaven if minimum.

If any of the other options - 3NT is perfect or at least worth giving a try.

---------------------------

Below Blue Team Precision responses:

2•-Pass=0-9cP,6-7•
2•-2=0-9cP,4+
2•-2=0-9cP,4+
2•-2NT=#ASK distrib
2•-3=0-9cP,4+cd
2•-3=11-12cP,5+
2•-3=11-12cP,5+
2•-4=11-12cP,5+
2•-Game=Signoff

over 2NT:

3=3-4-1-5
3•=4-3-1-5
3=min,4-4-1-4
3=MAX,4-4-1-4
3NT=min,4-4-0-5
4=MAX,4-4-0-5

[glen]

csdenmark, on Dec 11 2008, 09:19 AM, said:

... 2•-2=0-9cP,4+ ...

For my fonts, this is a perfect example of out-of-the-box thinking

[TylerE]

I dislike 2♦ on that hand. In my main precision partnership, we play 2♦ as described (can be (4-3)=1=5), and 2♣ 'promises' 6, but we generally open 2♣ rather than 2♦ with a club holding like AKQxx or AKJTx.

[awm]

Note that Claus' Blue Team responses don't include any call for hands with patterns like:

3343
2353
3253
3352

with 0-9 points.

Basically, these hands are the big losers for the methods. This eleven point hand is no bargain either -- you can relay with 2NT but playing a 4-3 club fit with no ruffs in the short hand is hardly an elegant solution.

I think I would bid 2♥ and hope for the best. Hopefully you play the style where a 4315 opener corrects to 2♠.

[jdonn]

awm, on Dec 11 2008, 03:44 PM, said:

I think I would bid 2♥ and hope for the best. Hopefully you play the style where a 4315 opener corrects to 2♠.

I definitely prefer that style, in my experience it has worked every time it has come up (5 or 6 times), even though you can obviously construct shapes for responder where you want opener to pass anyway (such as 2542).

[glen]

jdonn, on Dec 11 2008, 09:57 PM, said:

I definitely prefer that style...

agreed, and the other point to make is to bid it smoothly - not tank, tank, tank, 2♥, but a we-have-np 2♥, while behind the poker face you are thinking "please bid a suit opponents!"

[lexlogan]

2NT, planning to pass 3♣, otherwise bid 3NT. 4414 is much less frequent than 3415 or 4315, so I'm not too worried about 3♣. Pass hoping they compete is also reasonable.

I play much the same structure, except that I treat 2D-3D as natural inviting 3NT or 5D, opener may pass with a diamond void or poor hand. Offhand I don't see what 3D as 4-4 majors does that 2NT doesn't do.

[han]

Seems like a clear 2H bid.

[Free]

han, on Dec 12 2008, 04:30 AM, said:

Seems like a clear 2H bid.

Agree

[benlessard]

That why im not fond of 2D precision.

Its not clear the 3415/4315 are better at 2D than at 2C. And its clear losing the 2D preempt is a higher cost than the downside of opening 4414 with 1M or 1Nt + the downside of 4405 hands.

[dbsboy]

ok thx for all the responses.

I will change the response structure to 2D-2H as pass or correct.

[shintaro]

[D;)

Hi

Why not just drop the 2♦ opener and open 2♣ with either a 6 card Club suit or a good 5 card club suit

Then play the 2!♦ 2!♥ 2!♠ as 3 weak 2;'s

Works for us

[brianshark]

Having the 2♣ opener promise 6 is very useful. A lot of bad scores from opening 2♣ come when the suit quality is poor and/or you have only 5 because you often play in the wrong partscore. 2♦ is a rare enough opening anyway, so if you get the odd bad score from it, it should pay off in good scores you'll get from your 2♣ opening promising 6.

[benlessard]

Quote

Having the 2♣ opener promise 6 is very useful. A lot of bad scores from opening 2♣ come when the suit quality is poor and/or you have only 5 because you often play in the wrong partscore.

I keep getting this comment a lot and i think that we must be doing something wrong since we are constantly getting good result with our 2C opening

I strongly suggest to drop the 2D, its too rare not so efficient and the alternative of opening 2C is equal or just slightly inferior. Just that you ll need to find a way to deal with 4414.

[TylerE]

I'm ok with 2♣ only being 5 at IMPs, but at MP you miss 1NT far to often imo.

[keylime]

This is one of the main reasons why I play 4cM with canape now - this handtype gave me nightmares....

[shintaro]

Dealing with the 4414 or any 4441 is relatively easy if you use your 1♦ opener to merely promise 11 - 15 NO 5 Card major Possibly a ♦ Void or a 11 - 12 NT

That also works for us