[jocdelevat]

My 2 cents here: even I agree with OP I still think commentators are not robots.
I wanted to tell to one of the main coordinator and commentator(Not a yellow not a star) to stop rooting for one team. Second I wanted to tell to the vugraph operator and to the main comentator to stop announcing the smoke break(just short break should be enough) because I try to give up of that habit. I didn't say anything to them.

[JoAnneM]

I am still mad about the comments made by one commentator when our Lusky team was playing. Sour grapes is an understatement.

Of course I was super sensitive to it as they were personal friends but it still seemed unprofessional coming from a bridge legend.

Jo Anne
District 20 President (Home of the Lusky team)

[pclayton]

JoAnneM, on Jul 28 2008, 09:15 PM, said:

I am still mad about the comments made by one commentator when our Lusky team was playing. Sour grapes is an understatement.

Of course I was super sensitive to it as they were personal friends but it still seemed unprofessional coming from a bridge legend.

Jo Anne
District 20 President (Home of the Lusky team)

Hi Joanne:

I commentated one of Lusky's segments and I think they had a fine run. I also realize that Zwerling, Horton, etc., while not as well known as others, aren't the new kids on the block either. I have kibbed them several times in person in big events and they play well.

I agree that some commentators go overboard by actively rooting for teams. This was very evident especially during the USBF. I think it shows a lack of judgment and poor taste.

[TimG]

pclayton, on Jul 29 2008, 10:03 AM, said:

I agree that some commentators go overboard by actively rooting for teams. This was very evident especially during the USBF. I think it shows a lack of judgment and poor taste.

Overboard is a bad thing, but I generally don't mind if a commentator's preference is known from the commentary. Of course, what I think is fine someone else might think is overboard, so it's not an easy thing to address.

[Aberlour10]

DenisO, on Jul 28 2008, 11:37 AM, said:

Perhaps part of the problem was that (as usual) the Spingold broadcasts appeared to be scheduled at the last minute and Roland didn't seem to be involved in organising the commentators? He normally gives us a great mix of commentators who are usually just right for a particular event.

Rumors come around, Mr Vu has been seen enjoying english summer in the noble cricket atmosphere of The Oval, with the cool drink in the hand

[pigpenz]

JoAnneM, on Jul 29 2008, 12:15 AM, said:

I am still mad about the comments made by one commentator when our Lusky team was playing.  Sour grapes is an understatement.

Of course I was super sensitive to it as they were personal friends but it still seemed unprofessional coming from a bridge legend.

Jo Anne
District 20 President (Home of the Lusky team)

being former district 20 recorder I agree

[Rossoneri]

And now for the HK Inter-city bridge we finally have no commentators....So even if I wanted to point out that Patrick Choy is (or maybe was, I'm not very sure if he still is) an active member in the WBF and Esther Khunying is the PABF President, I have no commentator to tell

Matmat seems to be enjoying the silence though, last I spoke to him.

Edit: There seems to be a commentator in my room, but I can't seem to msg him privately.

[FrancesHinden]

Aberlour10, on Jul 29 2008, 08:21 PM, said:

DenisO, on Jul 28 2008, 11:37 AM, said:

Perhaps part of the problem was that (as usual) the Spingold broadcasts appeared to be scheduled at the last minute and Roland didn't seem to be involved in organising the commentators? He normally gives us a great mix of commentators who are usually just right for a particular event.

Rumors come around, Mr Vu has been seen enjoying english summer in the noble cricket atmosphere of The Oval, with the cool drink in the hand

He has indeed. I have finally met him in person.

[jillybean]

Well there you go, who allowed Roland to have a day off?

[inquiry]

I was unable to see the commentators, since I was in Vegas. But for the most part I think commentors have a difficult time. Note the comments above about commentors being harsh on certain players, etc. Also good commentators should bring aspects of the personalities to the kibitzers.

Commentators can have a hard time, do they point out problems the players might have faced and failed upon.

Imagine you are commentating on this world class event hand from a recent event......

Scoring: IMP


1♣* - (P) - 1♦* - (P)
1♥* - (P) - 1NT - (all pass)

---

This hand provided a lot of potential for discussion and commentary. Some of which would not have been very flattering to one or the other pair if it had been stated. West opened a polish 1♣, and the comments about the bidding were, well, less than totally helpful.

One person suggested that they thought EW played polish club, another agreed, and 1♥ was explained as it could be a weak NT hand with only 3♥'s. No one discussed the options for NS on the bidding (should south double 1♦, or even what 1♦ was), nor how the bidding might go at the other table where a natural bidding system was used EW (the bidding would be 1♦ by west, not 1♣ and 1NT by EAST, so the question is would South double 1NT for takeout at the other table and what would double of 1♦ be at this table? Diamonds? Takeout?) A discussion of this issues would have benefitial I think.

The commentators did tell us what EW use to play before they adopted polish 1♣ however. Next no one discussed options for the opening lead, and when south lead the heart ACE and north played the heart nine, no one discussed rather south might take the heart nine might be "encouraging" (normal count/attitude) or discouraging (upside/down count and attitude), nor advantage of EAST false-carding with the five of hearts instead of an honest four. South made the excellent switch to the spade 2 and got an obviously encouraging nine from north, so the hand should be open book now. East would have raised hearts with four, and partner would not encourage with 9x of hearts, nor waste the heart nine from Q9x, so south should guess north has Q9 doubleton heart and good spades. Not including the ACE.

No one discussed rather EAST should play for duck a diamond here playing for down one, or try to make by going after clubs, nor after the club king held, which way to play. No one pointed out that NS gave very honest counts in the suits lead by declearer (clubs now, diamonds later). Instead the discussion was rather or not EW was about national teams and players from various countries (not about the hand in question... during the play). And discussion of partnerships no longer playing together or either player still in this event. Then, when South took the second club, and cleared spades. East gave up on clubs (no entry) and lost the diamond hook. Now he was sure down three when the hook lost...

North took the diamond king, cashed top spade and played spade to south's ten. Who took the club jack in this position....

Scoring: IMP


1♣* - (P) - 1♦* - (P)
1♥* - (P) - 1NT - (all pass)

---

This is now VERY hard for the commentors. What should the commentors say after this HUGE blunder by south? Would something like "a blind spot by south", or "how the hell could south miss the endplay on dummy"? Be too harsh? It was clear this was an obvious blind spot and it is equally clear all the kibitzer saw it too. One doesn't want to beat south up for the misplay. But the commentors actually said....

"n/s got all their tricks
good def"

Really? One has to wonder if the commentors were watching at all. Perhaps this "good def(ence)" comment was made to avoid humiliating the south player. But I suspect the commentors were not watching nor thinking about the hand. In fact, during the entire hand, there was not one useful comment about the bidding (if you skip the fact that "are they playing polish club" might be a useful comment) and the discussion of what a 1♥ bid might be. And absolutely no comment about the play, other than the quote above.

Fortunately, the standard of commenting is much higher than what was displayed on this hand as a whole, and bear in mind... it is very important not to try to show how much smarter you (the commentor who can see all 4 hands) is than the player (who sees only their hand and dummy). So sometimes, a commentator has to bite their lip when a play like the one above happens... we all make mistakes, even the best players as this hand shows.

[nige1]

I didn't watch much of the Spingold but for the few other events I have kibitzed, the standard of commentary has been pretty good -- especially, if you choose commentators like David Burn. I enjoy the humour; and the odd snippet of autobiographical information adds interest.

I guess it is quite hard to comment on-line with the constant worry that you may make a mistake in analysis or just duplicate what others are typing.

It would be great if the gist of each pair's system card were fed to BBO's Full Disclosure software, so that kibitzers could click on some calls to discover their meaning.

[TimG]

nige1, on Jul 30 2008, 09:59 PM, said:

especially, if you choose commentators like David Burn.

It would be great if the gist of each pair's system card were fed to BBO's Full Disclosure software, so that kibitzers could click on some calls to discover their meaning.

Yes, I often choose which table to kibitz by looking to see where David is doing commentary.

As for system, in a WBF or USBF event (or others) where system cards are available online, commentators ought to be responsible for briefly reviewing the cards of those playing in the matches for which they are doing commentary. And, when something comes up that they are not sure about, they should first refer to the card rather than making blind guesses or asking if anyone knows what is going on.

[FrancesHinden]

TimG, on Jul 31 2008, 01:26 PM, said:

As for system, in a WBF or USBF event (or others) where system cards are available online, commentators ought to be responsible for briefly reviewing the cards of those playing in the matches for which they are doing commentary. And, when something comes up that they are not sure about, they should first refer to the card rather than making blind guesses or asking if anyone knows what is going on.

When I commentate, I always look up the system cards. They are rarely any use beyond opening bid and possibly first response. It is also normal to receive lots of private messages telling you what the bidding means, many disagreeing with each other.

[matmat]

FrancesHinden, on Jul 31 2008, 07:55 AM, said:

When I commentate, I always look up the system cards. They are rarely any use beyond opening bid and possibly first response. It is also normal to receive lots of private messages telling you what the bidding means, many disagreeing with each other.

hehe... well... you weren't commenting during the LV nationals :/. And it was pretty clear that a bunch of the people that were had no clue about the systems in place, or, for that matter, even about some of the easier standard bids...

[Walddk]

FrancesHinden, on Jul 30 2008, 02:20 PM, said:

Aberlour10, on Jul 29 2008, 08:21 PM, said:

DenisO, on Jul 28 2008, 11:37 AM, said:

Perhaps part of the problem was that (as usual) the Spingold broadcasts appeared to be scheduled at the last minute and Roland didn't seem to be involved in organising the commentators? He normally gives us a great mix of commentators who are usually just right for a particular event.

Rumors come around, Mr Vu has been seen enjoying english summer in the noble cricket atmosphere of The Oval, with the cool drink in the hand

He has indeed. I have finally met him in person.

Indeed. We had a very pleasant evening in a French restaurant. jallerton (Jeffrey Allerton, Frances' husband) and eggy (Steve Eginton) were also present.

As for the cricket I did not make it to The Oval, but I was at Lord's and Rose Bowl in Southampton for the Twenty20 Cup Finals Day. Must have been because of me that my team, Middlesex, won the trophy.

I have been away for 9 days and allowed myself not to have access to a laptop. Even if I had been at home, there is no guarantee that I would have been able to recruit better commentators.

Back now, and I'll try hard, as usual.

Roland

[peachy]

I am pretty sure I know who the "pompous misanalyst" is that folks here were talking about. Maybe someone could cue Roland in on that person's identity.

[jkdood]

yes good idea peachy, Please tell him:)

[jkdood]

No way, Justin. It's a MissAnalyst we're talkin about , not a MisterAnalyst

[peachy]

jkdood, on Aug 4 2008, 02:14 AM, said:

yes good idea peachy, Please tell him:)

Why me? You tell!