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This is hopefully an easy question, but how do you play these doubles?
Case 1:
(1♦)-P-(1NT)-X
Case 2:
(1♦)-P(you)-(1NT)-P;
(P)-X
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competing after 1D-1N by opps
#2
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Posted 2008-March-03, 12:09
1. Takeout
2. Penalty - probably with some diamond length.
#1 is pretty universal. #2 as penalty is a common interpretation, but I know of some that play the delayed double as TO.
2. Penalty - probably with some diamond length.
#1 is pretty universal. #2 as penalty is a common interpretation, but I know of some that play the delayed double as TO.
"Phil" on BBO
#3
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Posted 2008-March-03, 12:26
1. Takeout.
2. Penalty makes the most sense, I guess.
V
2. Penalty makes the most sense, I guess.
V
Still decidedly intermediate - don't take my guesses as authoritative.
"gwnn" said:
rule number 1 in efficient forum reading:
hanp does not always mean literally what he writes.
hanp does not always mean literally what he writes.
#4
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Posted 2008-March-03, 12:32
In case 2 when you double for penalty, how strong are these hands? With diamond length, perhaps a 15-18 1NT overcall was an option. Does this mean you have an unbalanced hand with diamonds or does double show you weren't quite strong enough to bid a 15-18 NT overcall the first time (hence maybe 13-bad 15).
#5
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Posted 2008-March-03, 12:42
Rob F, on Mar 3 2008, 10:32 AM, said:
In case 2 when you double for penalty, how strong are these hands? With diamond length, perhaps a 15-18 1NT overcall was an option. Does this mean you have an unbalanced hand with diamonds or does double show you weren't quite strong enough to bid a 15-18 NT overcall the first time (hence maybe 13-bad 15).
♠Ax ♥AJxx ♦AJxxx ♣xx
or
♠x ♥AQx ♦AKJxx ♣Kxxx
"Phil" on BBO
#6
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Posted 2008-March-03, 13:14
Both are take out i.m.o.
The penalty variation is so unlikely when partner has passed.
It needs good diamonds and a bunch of highcards.
You would probably double with that hand and bid NT in the next round.
With VBxx HVxx xx BTx I don't want to give up yet.
The penalty variation is so unlikely when partner has passed.
It needs good diamonds and a bunch of highcards.
You would probably double with that hand and bid NT in the next round.
With VBxx HVxx xx BTx I don't want to give up yet.
--
Finding your own mistakes is more productive than looking for partner's. It improves your game and is good for your soul. (Nige1)
Finding your own mistakes is more productive than looking for partner's. It improves your game and is good for your soul. (Nige1)
#7
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Posted 2008-March-07, 01:46
Clearly any modern bidder (one that isn't locked into Culbertson's 3 rules!) plays the first sequence as take-out.
The simplest rule is to play that the delayed double (in 6th hand) shows length in Opener's first suit and is take-out of any second suit they might now be showing. So the second double is penalty.
(-: Zel :-)
The simplest rule is to play that the delayed double (in 6th hand) shows length in Opener's first suit and is take-out of any second suit they might now be showing. So the second double is penalty.
(-: Zel :-)
(-: Zel :-)
#8 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2008-March-07, 01:58
Agree with t/o and pen.
Rob F, I think you will find good results Xing with hands that are as light as 13 or 14 as long as they have strong trick taking potential like Ax Ax KQT9x Jxxx etc. You can also have very strong unbalanced hands with diamonds that would pass 1D (see pclaytons second example).
This is one of my fav pen Xs because the deck is about even and we have a good lead that partner will make with the cards lying poorly for them. There is a huge upside and not a big downside (if they make it isnt game).
Rob F, I think you will find good results Xing with hands that are as light as 13 or 14 as long as they have strong trick taking potential like Ax Ax KQT9x Jxxx etc. You can also have very strong unbalanced hands with diamonds that would pass 1D (see pclaytons second example).
This is one of my fav pen Xs because the deck is about even and we have a good lead that partner will make with the cards lying poorly for them. There is a huge upside and not a big downside (if they make it isnt game).
#9
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Posted 2008-March-07, 02:05
1st T/O, 2nd Pen
- Andy -
We are all connected to each other biologically, to the Earth chemically, and to the rest of the universe atomically.
We're in the universe, and the universe is in us.
We are all connected to each other biologically, to the Earth chemically, and to the rest of the universe atomically.
We're in the universe, and the universe is in us.
#10
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Posted 2008-March-07, 14:56
I play both of them as take out.
(I play most DBL's as takeout unless it is agreed otherwise or unless it is clear.)
I wonder if takeout is not better on 2nd hand...even more at MP's?
eg with:
AKxx
KJxx
Jxxx
x
- - - or:
Axxx
KJxx
x
Qxxx
(I play most DBL's as takeout unless it is agreed otherwise or unless it is clear.)
I wonder if takeout is not better on 2nd hand...even more at MP's?
eg with:
AKxx
KJxx
Jxxx
x
- - - or:
Axxx
KJxx
x
Qxxx
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