[dcvetkov]

---

This is a hand from US finals, maybe it will be familiar to many ( but no peeking;)I found it interesting. Contract was 6♦ in both tables. I believe it was Rodwell from North, made on defensive gift and Stansby went down 1 playing with South hand.

I believe however that none of the declarer played the best, and that there is a superior line, that wasn't mentioned at all from Vugraph commentators.

Assume a club lead. You have couple of chances , so contract is not bad. What is your plan?

[Fluffy]

♥to the queen (loses), win continuation, ♠A, ♦A, ♦J spade to ♠10 and ruff a spade in dummy.

Since thisis a problem I'll think of an alternative, but it is hard to see one.

Maybe 2 rounds of trumps and 3 rounds of spades to endplay someone?, don't see the point for it.

[Flame]

I dont see a better line that taking those 2 finnses, maybe if we had anothr entry to dummy like the 10♦ we could clearn the ♣s ans play 3 rounds of ♠.
We can try the same without clearing the ♣s but when RHO will play ♣ will be in a guess.

[Halo]

Because the spade finesse doesn't necessarily help, I would draw trumps and play AK spades.

Depending on what the club lead looked like I may be able to judge the correct play if East does turn up with Qxx of spades and has to exit from king of clubs.

Otherwise, I will end up finessing hearts - although then I suppose a last tiny possibility is that if I can place King of clubs with West, and there is no 'show-up', I amaze my friends by dropping a singleton king of hearts in East.

[Fluffy]

you cannot endplay west with third round of spades ebcause he iwll play a heart through.

If you endplay East, then a simple finese would had worked.....

[Halo]

Fluffy, on Jun 11 2007, 05:53 AM, said:

you cannot endplay west with third round of spades ebcause he iwll play a heart through.

If you endplay East, then a simple finese would had worked.....

If West has at least three spades to the Queen then he will be playing a heart through whatever line we choose.

We are comparing either player having Qx spades versus East having Qxx. On that basis I think playing for the drop is better. There may of course be a deeper insight into the hand that I have not considered.

(Edit: I have been assuming diamonds 31 in this discussion)

[Fluffy]

Right, that's what I though at first, then forgot lol.

Also to note, if East fails to return a heart after winning ♥K, we can squeeze East instead of ruffing 4th spade (Wich risks a ruff from west).

This is the ending position

J
A
-
Q

. . . . . . Qx
. . . . . . -
. . . . . . -
. . . . . . K

Kx
x
-
-



EDIT: I though I found a line tackling spades first, but doesn't work, would need Dumy to have ♦10. Taking ♠Qx on West is never better than taking ♠Qxxx(x) on East.

[Halo]

It's almost worth the two finesses just for the chance of this ending!

Truth on reflection is that this is too close for me to call.

[Flame]

Are we looking at the same hand ?
Why wouldnt a ♠ finnese be enough ?
Why is the drop in ♠ better then a finnse ?

[twcho]

because even S finesse works, you still need to dispose your 4th S

[Flame]

twcho, on Jun 11 2007, 01:14 PM, said:

because even S finesse works, you still need to dispose your 4th S

We can check this by playing 2 rounds of ♦

[Flame]

If you think the ♣K is more then 50% with RHO maybe we can end play RHO with the 4th spade after our finnse wins and the trumps are 3-1 and RHO hold 4 spades.

[inquiry]

The heart finessee will eventually have to be taken if you can not find an endplay. You will possibly lose a ♠. But if not, a ♠ might be a userful endplay (of course, if you can ruff a ♠ without losing one, you are home.

1) Win ♣ACE
2) Cash two diamonds
3) Cash ♠ ACE.
4). Cross to the diamond JACK (3-1 diamonds more likely than 2-2... could also cross one trick earlier
5) ♠ to TEN.

If ♠Ten holds, cash spade king
if ♠Ten loses and ♥ comes back, hook, if not, hook hearts later

The interesting case is when the ♠Ten holds. If ♠ are 3-3 you are home. If EAST has four spades, You can try a strip squeeze or a simple endplay now. If you think the ♣King is with EAST, you can throw him in with the 13th spade. He has to return a heart (yeah) or a ♣ eqaully yeah if you are sure king is there.

Not sure But I would postpone the decision in hearts as long as I could.

NOTE, I kibitzed pretty all the finals, and I beleive I remember this hand, which sadly may have an influence on my line of play.

[fred]

Every time I lose a close match in an important tournament there are always a couple of nightmare hands in which I could (and usually should) have done better. These hands tend to haunt me for years

This was one of 2 such hands in this year's USBC Finals. I was on defense against 6D, probably should have figured out how to beat that contract, and failed to do so.

On my way home from Chicago yesterday I bought a copy of the New York Times to read on the plane. The bridge column was about this hand!

And here it is again!

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[dcvetkov]

fred, on Jun 12 2007, 09:42 AM, said:

Every time I lose a close match in an important tournament there are always a couple of nightmare hands in which I could (and usually should) have done better. These hands tend to haunt me for years

.

Sorry Fred.)) Was not even aware that it was you on defense and did not mean any disrespect. Hand was interesting though. Declarer can always prevail played from North hand and on a non heart lead played from South.

[dcvetkov]

inquiry, on Jun 11 2007, 03:44 PM, said:

The heart finessee will eventually have to be taken if you can not find an endplay. You will possibly lose a ♠. But if not, a ♠ might be a userful endplay (of course, if you can ruff a ♠ without losing one, you are home.

1) Win ♣ACE
2) Cash two diamonds
3) Cash ♠ ACE.
4). Cross to the diamond JACK (3-1 diamonds more likely than 2-2... could also cross one trick earlier
5) ♠ to TEN.

If ♠Ten holds, cash spade king
if ♠Ten loses and ♥ comes back, hook, if not, hook hearts later

The interesting case is when the ♠Ten holds. If ♠ are 3-3 you are home. If EAST has four spades, You can try a strip squeeze or a simple endplay now. If you think the ♣King is with EAST, you can throw him in with the 13th spade. He has to return a heart (yeah) or a ♣ eqaully yeah if you are sure king is there.

Not sure But I would postpone the decision in hearts as long as I could.

NOTE, I kibitzed pretty all the finals, and I beleive I remember this hand, which sadly may have an influence on my line of play.

Ben is as usually , correct. but Maybe influenced by Vugraph;). It looks like need one out of 2 finesses, but you also have to worry about 4th round spade loser.

You still have to guess the end position, but unless East blanks his heart king with poker face, you may have enough clues. This will be the layout with 4 cards to play. East will be strip squeezed on last trump and has to abandon heart guard. Now, do you finesse hearts or play for the drop? Odds appriori are 4-3 that king is in West hand, but if you believe that club king was in east, then playing for the drop is the play. Note without Queen♣ threat in dummy, cashing last trump and playing a spade to endplay East is probably still better then finesse H


-
AQx
-
Q

- 9
XX? Kx
- -
J K
x
xx
x
-

I think the point of the hand is that heart finesse early in the hand is premature, and losing finesse and a heart return will leave you badly placed with entryless dummy and thats the line both declarers took . I dont think any of the Vugraph commentators mentioned more detailed outcome o this hand in the endgame

[cnszsun]

inquiry, on Jun 12 2007, 04:44 AM, said:

1) Win ♣ACE
2) Cash two diamonds
3) Cash ♠ ACE.
4). Cross to the diamond JACK (3-1 diamonds more likely than 2-2... could also cross one trick earlier
5) ♠ to TEN.

If ♠Ten holds, cash spade king
if ♠Ten loses and ♥ comes back, hook, if not, hook hearts later

Didn't this line give up the chance of trump 2-2 and East holding ♠Qxxx?
So, not cashing ♠A, instead ♦A, ♦J to dummy, play ♠ to jack. This line will prevail if ♦2-2 and ♠Q onside, only losing to west holding stiff ♠Q.

[Halo]

When trumps are 22 you can just take the heart finesse and finesse spades later.

I think Inquiry's line is technically correct and gives some small extras based on opponents actions.

My own earlier notion of cashing the top spades at some point is clearly technically inferior and could only be justified if you believe West will (almost) never lead a club holding the kings in both clubs and hearts.

[fred]

dcvetkov, on Jun 13 2007, 05:23 AM, said:

fred, on Jun 12 2007, 09:42 AM, said:

Every time I lose a close match in an important tournament there are always a couple of nightmare hands in which I could (and usually should) have done better. These hands tend to haunt me for years

.

Sorry Fred.)) Was not even aware that it was you on defense and did not mean any disrespect. Hand was interesting though. Declarer can always prevail played from North hand and on a non heart lead played from South.

No need to apologize and absolutely no offense taken - I just thought it was funny that this hand seems to be following me around

Fred Gitelman
Bridge Base Inc.
www.bridgebase.com

[Fluffy]

So east had ♠Q9xx and ♥K with only 1 diamond?