[inquiry]

First, I am not fully versed in Acol, but I think four card majors are frequently opened. So is it reasonable to assume that partner probably doesn't have either 4S or 4Hs unless he is 4-4-1-4?  That is if partner has at most 3H and 3S, the opponents have at least a 9 card spade fit plus an 8 card heart fit.  

So we have at least a 10 card club fit, and they rate to have at least 9 card spade fit. A second point is do you play weak notrump? If so, partner has either an unbalanced hand (4-4-1-4 perhaps and if not, then the opponents have really good two suit fit) or a balanced hand with extra values (15hcp+).

If partner has a strong NT, I think we want to be in 3NT or 4Sx. If parnter is unbalanced, despite my two defensive tricks, I think we will want to bid 5Cs over their likely 4S bid. We may even have 6C if partner has some odd minimum like
                           S:Axx H:Kxxx D:x C:KQxxx

Thus, I want to make a bid that gets partner to cooperate with the final decision. What I will not bid: 3C (too much underbid), not 4C (bypass possible 3NT and does not invite partner to participate in the decision of what to do over 4S by my LHO), not double (TO) with this distribution, not 5C (to unalateral). So that leaves PASS, 2NT, 3S, 4S as the options.

PASS works sometimes if you can anticipate partner balancing, but with a singleton SPADE, that isn't going to happen. 4S as a splinter is intriquing, but not sure it will help you find slam if partner has the minimum shown earlier. If 2NT shows somekind of club fit (aka Robson/Segal notes), then 2NT is ok. But probably I will bid 3S. Now I can make a forcing pass on some auctions that reach 4S. The expecation is that if partner has something like  S:KQx HKQx DQJx CKxxx he will double 4S (after 3S cue) but with an offensive hand like shown earlier, he will bid on.

If my Aces were kings (less defense), I would probably just leap to 5Cs now. QED.

[hrothgar]

Quote

This came up last night:
Imps all Green
You are playing Acol, where the opening 1C bid almost certainly guarantees 4+

1C (2S) ?
9
Ax
xxxx
Axxxxx

2S was a WJO
Your bid?

I see two reasonable bids: 5C and 3S, though I would also consider 3N to mix things up.

I'd probably bid

5C    70% of the time
3S    25% of the time
3N    05% of the time

[jjsb]

i guess it also depends against whom i'm playing . in practice my choice will go on 5C . ihave the impression that doesn't mean  the auction is finished ...

regards
syl (aka "jjsb")

[inquiry]

Hi Friend,

If you are just going to blast to 5C with this hand, I think a much better bid is 4S (splinter). The advantage of the splinter bid here is to set up a forcing pass situation if they bid 5S over 5C. Second, 4S may get you to 6C if partner has the right hand. Since 4S committed you to 5C anyway, it implies at least some interest in 6C. So 4S keeps a lot of doors open. and invites your partner to use bridge judgment based upon your description of your hand. Don't bid your hand in a vaccumm..

[jjsb]

Quote

Hi Friend,

If you are just going to blast to 5C with this hand, I think a much better bid is 4S (splinter). The advantage of the splinter bid here is to set up a forcing pass situation if they bid 5S over 5C. Second, 4S may get you to 6C if partner has the right hand. Since 4S committed you to 5C anyway, it implies at least some interest in 6C. So 4S keeps a lot of doors open. and invites your partner to use bridge judgment based upon your description of your hand. Don't bid your hand in a vaccumm..

well i'm probably wrong ther but i have hte impression that if i decided to bid 5C is because i'm not searching for something more it's purely preemptive . The problem , and i agree , is my hand preemptive ? well it's not clear at all , it's why it's very hard. But in those case , and it's only my opinion i just decided to put pressure not telling opps structure of my hand . I may not help partner but i'm not helping opps too... as i said before auction is not finish.. again i do'nt say i'm rigth doing that 4S is probably the best auction , it's just that my choice i would probably choice at table would be 5C

regards
syl (jjsb in bbo)

[inquiry]

Tada... 3S or 4S work opposite this hand (actually 4S works better for getting to lucky grand slam, but who is getting there?)

[TheZerg]

acol: 1C (2S) ?

9
Ax
xxxx
Axxxxx

since opener promises 4-card C and denies weak nt there are huge chances for slam (big fit, 7 lossing tricks, 5 good controls), only the thing that may stop us from biding is is partner wanting to wack 5S (i doubt that p is missing two aces)

scientific method may start with some cuebid (i initially tought 3S but several players sugessted 4S and that seems sligtly better as both 4S and 4NT minimize ops chances to find maybe a good 6S save)

less schentific method is to bid directly 6 and hope for the best - afterall there is a >>75% chance that the slam will make (ops wil have less info, drawback is you may lose 7C if p Axx Kxx AK KQxxx will pass)

[TheZerg]

ups ~ and now i see the other hand  ;D

Opener's hand was
AJTx
Kxxx
void
KJxxx

at the table - after 1C (2S) 5C
if i am the opener i will pass 5C (missing the slam)

he already promissed something very similar with that type of hand (ok - he has only 6 loosing tricks, not 7) and partner made a preemptive bid (maybe he shoundt)

it is quite probably that the 5C was made on C length and S shortage but what guaratewes us we dont have two or three loosers in H and C after that bidding

i know usually is not a good ideea to preempt 5C after ops preempted before so 5C should be made on a very weak hand (espec since the 4-th player didnt bidded yet) when the preemtor is absoultely sure 5C dont make and trys to put some pressure on ops (4S by ops being a sure thing, 4th player having to choose between pas/dbl/5S/cuebid+ at a very high level)

[luis]

The anti-splinter appeared again!!!

I want to propose a bid and I'm interested in your opinions:
Fact:  We are playing at expert level
I agree 100% with inquiry, we may want to be in 3N, 4sx or can have a club slam (a club game is VERY likely).
I'll focus on how to know if we have a slam. My bid is:

4d!!

Because the key to slam is to find opener short in diammonds.

The anti-splinter bid works as follows: initially should be taken as a splinter but if opener has a short diammond then should be interpreted as anti-splinter: no values in that suit and a hand interested in slam if we have no wasted values in diammonds. So pd with 2 diammonds knows we have two quick losers and with 1 diammond knows we can play slam..... He can also valorize a holding like a singleton Ace or Ax in diammonds if he has a good unbalanced hand.

An example of the anti-splinter bid is:

Axx, Jxxx, x,  Kxxxxx

pd - you
1d  - 1h
1s - 1n
2c - 3h!

Partner is short in hearts and you have no values there you have a club fit and a key honor in spades plus diammond shortness.  Partner might have:
KQxx, x, Axxx, AQxx and we have a slam :-) the 3h bids shows no wasted values in hearts and a clear support for clubs.

Maybe this is interesting enough to start a thread :-)