[Miron]

Scoring: IMP

---

How would you bid this hand?
East opens 2♠ (3-8, 5♠), whatever you say West will say 4♠.

I think we had not a great auction, but could lead to good result:
2♠ - 3♦ - 4♠ - 4NT
pass - 5♣ - pass - 5♦
pass - 5♥ - pass - 5NT
pass - pass - pass
What went wrong here? I was the 4NT bidder. This is no assign blame. I don't care who made the wrong dicision, I'm just interrested how this should be bid. And how should I continue after the 2♠-3♦-4♠ sequence.

Thanks for all ideas.

edited: Thanks mikeh, there was really a typo there.

[mikeh]

I would not have overcalled 3♦: I would double: the ♥ are just long enough and the hand just strong enough to do so. Having said that, 3♦ is not horrible, nor would an overcall of 4N attract strong language from me.

I do not understand the bidding as posted: I assume, from the body of the post, that west bid 4♠, not 3♠ as the posted auction has it.

If west bid 3♠, then 4N was presumably keycard, but that obviously was not so: it looks as if north bid 4N over 4♠ and S took it as takeout (initially) or natural (weird) and showed his second suit, and then cuebid 5♥ and passed 5N, in a state of bewilderment.

What is 4N? Is it keycard or is it takeout? I would reject a natural interpetation as the least playable.

Whatever it is, I don't like it. The answer to keycard is not going to help: while S may have a ♠ void, N won't be able to place the contract with assurance even if S can and does show it. And takeout makes no sense... N knows what trump is... in making these comments, I know what N meant 4N as ... the problem is what does it mean, not what does N want it to mean.


If I trust partner to have his values for a 3-level vulnerable overcall missing AJ10 of his suit, I bid 6♦: it rates to have play even if he has an unlikely ♠ and will almost certainly be cold if he doesn't.

Now, S could, I suppose, bid grand, but I wouldn't... at least, I am not going to claim that I would...... having seen both hands, I cannot make such a claim with any certainty.

[Kalvan14]

IMHO, N migh safely assume that E-W cannot have less than 9 spades after this auction (also considering that they should have almost nothing outside the spade suit). I agree with Mikeh: best N bid is 6♦. It is quite unlikely to get to 7, pity. As usual, pre-empts (even crazy ones like this, at equal vuln) work very often.

[pclayton]

I think a reasonable start is: 2♠ - dbl - 4♠ - dbl (responsive; I play them to the moon).

After the responsive double, I think South is too good for 5N pick a slam and needs to cue 5♠. North, looking at no wastage in spades and nice values can smell a grand.

However, with the likely bad breaks, its hard for North just to bid the grand. Preempts work and I can see these hands stalling at 6♦.

South has a great hand too, but 5♠ says an awful lot. Is it reasonable to play pard for both minor bullets with the responsive double? Maybe.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

your options after 2S are either dbl, i.e.
treat the hand as 3-suiter, or 4NT,
treating the hand as 2-suiter.
I dont think 3D is an option.

If you choose dbl, after 4S I would have
a tough choice, I would probably double.

After 4NT partner can probably bid 6D
direct.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[whereagles]

Easy way out, with nothing fancy:

(2♠) .. 3♦ .. (4♠) .. 5♦
(pass) 6♦

[Codo]

With so strong bidding from the opps, it is hard ( for me impossible) to bid the grand with confidence.
I had start with 4 NT from South. If I have a hand, which fits this bid, I will use it, even if I had prefered to have fewer Hearts for this bid, so that the risk to miss a great Heart fit is lower.
I see no way, how North can find out about both marriages, the ace king in H and the Spade void, so 6 Diamond is enough.

But I seen no convincing way to bid the grand with another approach.

[Poky]

This one is very easy.

2♠ 4NT pass 6♦
pass 7♦

When you have a minor two-suiter the best you can do is - bid it!

[Echognome]

Poky, on May 17 2006, 11:47 AM, said:

This one is very easy.

2♠ 4NT pass 6♦
pass 7♦

When you have a minor two-suiter the best you can do is - bid it!

Don't buy it. So it has gone (2♠) - 4NT - (P) - ?

Note the 2nd pass! So North is going to confidently bid 6♦ with 3 quick losers in spades and two in hearts. Let's give South a reasonable hand of: x x KQxxxx KQJxx. And would you not bid 4NT over 2♠? If not that, then how about --- xx KQxxx KQJxxx or the same with the majors reversed.


And what about South? Why should south raise? Can't North have Ax x ATxxxx JTx?

I think it's still a guess for both North and South and you just aren't going to have the room over heavy preemption to do anything but guess well.

[bid_em_up]

How would everyone treat this auction?

(2♠) 4♠?

I ask this because everyone appears to think that X, 3♦, or 4N are the only "acceptable" calls, but 4♠ appears to be the best descriptive bid.

Spade void, slam interest opposite any values, minor suits strongly preferred, hearts tolerated. Isnt that what 4♠ should be?

[foo]

bid_em_up, on May 17 2006, 01:26 PM, said:

How would everyone treat this auction?

(2♠) 4♠?

I ask this because everyone appears to think that X, 3♦, or 4N are the only "acceptable" calls, but 4♠ appears to be the best descriptive bid.

Spade void, slam interest opposite any values, minor suits strongly preferred, hearts tolerated. Isnt that what 4♠ should be?

♠T985♥Q8♦AJT4♣AT4

♠♥AK3♦KQ753♣KQ876

E Deals.
(2S)-??

3s= Western Cue
3n= To Play
4m= H+m 3- losers
4h= To Play
4s= ??
4n= D+C 3- losers

I can see sense in playing
4S= D+C w/ 3 H's 3- losers
4N= D+C w/o 3 H's 3- losers

Let's say you play this gadget. Now what?
(2S)-4S!-pa-??

4n= 1430 in H's (or should it be To Play? Pick your poison.)
5m= To Play
5h= To Play
5s= Slam Force in D's or C's. Pick one or bid 5N.

So, using these agreements:
(2S)-4S!-pa (almost certainly)-5S!;-pa-5N-pa-6D

OR (if 4S!-4N is 1430 in H's)
(2S)-4S!-pa-4N;pa-5H-pa-7D because Advancer, looking at the CA & DA, knows Overcaller has the HA+HK

Interesting.

[civill]

If not LEB,
2♠    2NT    ?

...7♦

or if nor Michaels,
2♠    dbl    ?

...7♦

or if...

This post has been edited by civill: 2006-May-18, 22:15

[Miron]

civill, on May 19 2006, 05:12 AM, said:

If not LEB,
2♠    2NT    ?

...7♦

or if nor Michaels,
2♠    dbl    ?

...7♦

or if...

I just missed this one. What is the point here?