[luke warm]

Winstonm, on Oct 16 2005, 03:00 PM, said:

A 3N bid is a blunderbuss bid and a slam killer - it takes too much room so it needs very precise definitions: opening NT without 3 card support and without Aces and Spaces, which is basically all this hand has. IMO, 2C is the better start if my choices are limited - it leaves room for exploration and has better chances of getting the NT from the correct side.

Winston

i agree with your opinion of 3NT ... but you said "..it takes too much room so it needs very precise definitions.." what precise definition is given to a 3NT response? 4333 with 3 card support and 14-16 hcp... if this hand doesn't fit that *precise* definition, no hand ever will

do away with the 3NT response (or that definition) if you want... but if it exists, use it... at least opener knows i have 15 hcp on average, 4333 shape, and 3 card support... i hate it too, but it's (systemically) the most perfect bid available

[Winstonm]

luke warm, on Oct 16 2005, 03:26 PM, said:

Winstonm, on Oct 16 2005, 03:00 PM, said:

A 3N bid is a blunderbuss bid and a slam killer - it takes too much room so it needs very precise definitions: opening NT without 3 card support and without Aces and Spaces, which is basically all this hand has.  IMO, 2C is the better start if my choices are limited - it leaves room for exploration and has better chances of getting the NT from the correct side.

Winston

i agree with your opinion of 3NT ... but you said "..it takes too much room so it needs very precise definitions.." what precise definition is given to a 3NT response? 4333 with 3 card support and 14-16 hcp... if this hand doesn't fit that *precise* definition, no hand ever will

do away with the 3NT response (or that definition) if you want... but if it exists, use it... at least opener knows i have 15 hcp on average, 4333 shape, and 3 card support... i hate it too, but it's (systemically) the most perfect bid available

I think there is a significant difference between these two hands:

KJx, xxx, AQxx, AJ9

and

Axx, xxx, Axx, AQJx

Given the definition, the first hand qualifies; IMO, the second hand is not suitable (although it may qualify) so I don't want to make this bid - just because the system allows a bid doesn't make it best. System allows me to open 1N on xx, Axx, AKx, KQJxxx but I think it's better to open 1C and rebid 3C.

Winston

[flytoox]

I am in the camp of 2C. If pd can raise, that would be very sweet. If pd bids sth else, I can cope it too.

[adhoc3]

Jlall, on Oct 15 2005, 09:00 PM, said:

well the problem is you really dont want to play 3N and you wrongside the hand.

Indeed.


Is there "right and only" answer?

[dirtbag]

too many players find 8 major suit cards fits and then try to play the hand in 3nt. clearly the original poster plays some form of 'jacoby 3nt' style of bid where 1h/s-3nt shows 3 card support and 14-16 hcp. but the fact of the matter is, partner opened and u have a 5 trick hand, cropping the bidding space has to be the least constructive method i can imagine.

to quote truscott....'points smoints'

[HeartA]

I would never use such 3NT convention either. 2♣ would be my only response.