[pclayton]

Al_U_Card, on Oct 6 2005, 12:11 PM, said:

Hannie, on Oct 6 2005, 01:46 PM, said:

I think that the only alternative is 3S.

3S, except when partner passes or bids game holding 4 H cards and 11 hcp.....

In which case pard misbid with 2♣ by not making a neg x.

[junyi_zhu]

Jurek S, on Oct 6 2005, 12:59 PM, said:

You can't say "sorry gtg" or anything like that.

You have ♠xx, ♥AKTx, ♦AJ9x, ♣Jxx

Bidding: 1♦(by you) - 2♣ - 2♠ - pass
?

Please, do not try to covince me to 4 card major or weak NT.

easy 2nt to me, you don't commit to 3NT yet and partner still can check for club stopper at three level.

[Fluffy]

I would bid 2NT, but then I play too much MP after all.

[Fluffy]

Walddk, on Oct 6 2005, 02:26 PM, said:

2NT. It doesn't promise a club stopper in my methods, merely a description of my hand pattern with a doubleton spade. If responder is strong enough to bid on, he can ask about my notrump seriousness by rebidding 3♣.

Then we still have plenty of room to investigate.

Roland

I would be happy if my agreements stated if 2♠ was forcing or not, if I had agreed I am pretty sure my agreements woul stop exactly on the 2♠ bid

[zasanya]

3♣
Almost everybody who voted against it ,have done so because it sounds like GF.
Well, it is P who created the GF by bidding 2 ♠, not me.
So tell him "I don't have ♣ stopper ,I don't have 3 cards ♠,I don't have 5 cards ♦,I dont have a stronger than promised opening,I have almosr certainly 4 card ♥"

[Walddk]

zasanya, on Oct 7 2005, 10:57 AM, said:

Well, it is P who created the GF by bidding 2 ♠, not me.

Must be your individual agreement with your favourite partner. I don't know anyone who plays 2♠ (or any new suit for that matter) as game forcing after an overcall. One round force, yes, or even non-forcing if you play "negative free bids".

Roland

[helene_t]

2NT if I succeed in bidding it a tempo with a poker face.

3♠ it I'm worried about ethical issues. Oops I wrote 2♠, you're right, Cherdano, an insufficent bid is probably not the best way to deal with an ethical problem

This post has been edited by helene_t: 2005-October-07, 06:41

[whereagles]

I've said this several times, but I reiterate it: description of shape and hcp should take precedence over location of honors. This conclusion is not mine. It's Goren's. In this problem, it means: you mussn't worry about stoppers before you have described your hand accurately in terms of shape and hcp.

Therefore, I believe the technically correct bid is 2NT. Sure, you may go down in 2NT, but in the long run this is the bid that will lead to the best results on average. It is only AFTER the shape/hcp description is finished that you need to worry about stoppers.

[Al_U_Card]

pclayton, on Oct 6 2005, 04:34 PM, said:

Al_U_Card, on Oct 6 2005, 12:11 PM, said:

Hannie, on Oct 6 2005, 01:46 PM, said:

I think that the only alternative is 3S.

3S, except when partner passes or bids game holding 4 H cards and 11 hcp.....

In which case pard misbid with 2♣ by not making a neg x.

I agree . Too many pick-up pards I guess.....But looking at AKJxx xxxx Qxx x he might just want to bid his best suit before the 5 level appears.....

[inquiry]

Jurek S, on Oct 6 2005, 08:59 AM, said:

You have ♠xx, ♥AKTx, ♦AJ9x, ♣Jxx

Bidding: 1♦(by you) - 2♣ - 2♠ - pass
            ?

2NT. sigh.

Some time ago Mishovnbg started describing some transfer advance system he likes he termed "Equality". This method almost never uses negative double (GASP) so never will be popular. And it has some other problems, but on this hand, equality would have worked out better I think.

In equality, after 1♦=(2♣)-? the bids are:

• DBL Regular takeout double, wow.
  
• 2D “5+ hearts, RF”
  
• 2H “5+ spades, RF”
  
• 2S Spades, not forcing
  
• 2NT Weak or game forcing raise
  
• 3C Mixed raise, not game forcing
  
• 3D Weak (but not desperately weak)
  
• 3H/3S Fit jump
  
• 4C Splinter

So if partner had bid 2♠ = negative free bid type thing you pass... and if partner had bid 2♥ to show 5+[sp\ and one round force, you would bid 2[sp] to show a weak hand and possible as few as two spades.

On auctions where BOTH minors have been bid naturally ( that is 1D-(2C), and 1♣-(1♦) ), the usual equality rules are slighly different. In the first case, dbl is negative, in the second case, the 1♠ bid is changed. Equality can be found in the archives here back about 18 months or you can find it on Dan Neil's webpgage.

[mikeh]

Walddk, on Oct 7 2005, 06:35 AM, said:

zasanya, on Oct 7 2005, 10:57 AM, said:

Well, it is P who created the GF by bidding 2 ♠, not me.

Must be your individual agreement with your favourite partner. I don't know anyone who plays 2♠ (or any new suit for that matter) as game forcing after an overcall. One round force, yes, or even non-forcing if you play "negative free bids".

Roland

2♠ as game force in this situation: I play that with several partners. I also play it as purely a 1 round force with a couple of others. My experience is that there is not much to choose between the two approaches: but my game is built around imps, and gf is (I think) decidely inferior at mps.

[han]

I have to agree with Ben that this is a VERY good auction for equality. I've been struggling with the method and there are several auctions where I wish the negative double was back.

I think that there are more negatives in the following sentence than Ben intended:

This method doesn't almost never use negative double (GASP) so never will be popular.

[Al_U_Card]

Hannie, on Oct 7 2005, 11:39 AM, said:

This method doesn't almost never use negative double (GASP) so never will be popular.

 

Translated into english, this means that because it almost always uses negative doubles it will never be popular........which IS possible, I suppose.... (not to be confused with double negatives which aren't never used in bridge...lol)

[Double !]

FYI

The Double Negative bid in bridge is a specialized convention for partners who have severe cases of Oppositional-Defiant Disorder, abbreviated "O.D.D." It (O.D.D.) manifests itself in many different ways at the bridge table such as refusing to raise partner when holding trump support, refusing to show a 4-card major when P opens 1m, or ignoring partner's defensive signals. (And, yes, this is a real Psychiatric diagnosis. Does anyone know anyone who qualifies? Treatment is available.)

lol: double negatives can obviously also refer to responses that show very weak hands in response to forcing bids.

DHL