[nekthen]

I have a general question about the sequence 1♠ p 2♦ p 2♥.
Presumably, 4N is RKCB for ♥, how can I bid RKCB for ♠? Lets assume we are not playing 2 over 1.
I had a practice hand on bridgez.net where p had 55 in the majors and I had 3244 and a 17 count. I tried 3♣ and of course the computer bids 4♥ and still 4N is rkcb in ♥. Would 3♠ be regarded as forcing? My slightly old school style assume that 3♥ and 3♠ are invitational
I used to play the old Blue Club and here 4♣ would show slam interest in ♥ while 4♦ would show the same in ♠

So the question is how do you set ♠ as the trump suit and keep slam options after the sequence 1♠ p 2♦ p 2♥?

[masse24]

If not playing 2/1, then yes, a jump to 3♠ is a Game-Force.
You could also force game with a 4SF 3♣ -- as you attempted to do.
If unhappy with your partner's subsequent jump to 4♥ you should have a stern discussion with partner at the bar during the post-mortem.

[apollo1201]

The forcing nature of the jump to 3♠ essentially depends on your major-fit style.

If 1♠-3♠ is invitational with a guaranteed 4+ cd-suport, then 1♠-2♦-2♥/♠-3♠ is probably invitational with 3 cards only.

In a full natural system, I believe 2♠ after 2♥ could be a minimum hand (good 10 to bad 12) with a ♠tolerance (maybe Hx♠) and a (seriously) unsufficent ♣ guard to bid 2NT. But for slam easing purposes, it could be better to decide 2♠ is invitational fit and 3♠ is forcing (as previously mentionned by masse). This does not prevent you from deciding follow-ups when opener rebids 2♠ rather than 2♥(then you have to force with 3♣/♥ and express an ambiguous fit at the 3 level). Overall, you might wrongside some 3NT or land in pushy games. Sacrifying precision on parials to reach slam accuracy is good for IMPs but less for MPs.

That is why lots of persons use some "gadgets" (in my case 2NT as I don't play Jacoby which does not fit too well with my other fits) to express the invitational with 3 cards support and render further fits unambiguously forcing.

You *obvisously* need to be on the same page as partner on those auctions. And absent special agreements aimed at easing further bids and clarifying situations as forcing or not, those auctions are tricky to handle...

[mike777]

nekthen, on 2015-July-03, 06:47, said:

I have a general question about the sequence 1♠ p 2♦ p 2♥.
Presumably, 4N is RKCB for ♥, how can I bid RKCB for ♠? Lets assume we are not playing 2 over 1.
I had a practice hand on bridgez.net where p had 55 in the majors and I had 3244 and a 17 count. I tried 3♣ and of course the computer bids 4♥ and still 4N is rkcb in ♥. Would 3♠ be regarded as forcing? My slightly old school style assume that 3♥ and 3♠ are invitational
I used to play the old Blue Club and here 4♣ would show slam interest in ♥ while 4♦ would show the same in ♠

So the question is how do you set ♠ as the trump suit and keep slam options after the sequence 1♠ p 2♦ p 2♥?

1) if 2d =gf then Now I bid 2s as spades and a slam try
2) to be fair some on the forum do not play 2s as a slam try in spades.

-------


if not playing 2/1 gf...then 3c then 3s must show spades as trumps and a slam try.
3c=4sf and gf. It helps it you do not open on crap. ?With a huge hand a soloway jumpshift helps....


1s=3d(nat/strong)
3h=3s

[Cyberyeti]

3♠ would be nat inv for us, 4th suit then 3♠ is forcing spade agreement although it gets awkward when partner bids 3N.

[nekthen]

nekthen, on 2015-July-03, 06:47, said:

I have a general question about the sequence 1♠ p 2♦ p 2♥.
Presumably, 4N is RKCB for ♥, how can I bid RKCB for ♠? Lets assume we are not playing 2 over 1.
I had a practice hand on bridgez.net where p had 55 in the majors and I had 3244 and a 17 count. I tried 3♣ and of course the computer bids 4♥ and still 4N is rkcb in ♥. Would 3♠ be regarded as forcing? My slightly old school style assume that 3♥ and 3♠ are invitational
I used to play the old Blue Club and here 4♣ would show slam interest in ♥ while 4♦ would show the same in ♠

So the question is how do you set ♠ as the trump suit and keep slam options after the sequence 1♠ p 2♦ p 2♥?

On reflection the computer is wrong to bid 4♥; 3♣ is game forcing in most partnerships so he can bid 3♥ to show 55 and i can bid 3♠ to finally set trumps for rkcb

[ggwhiz]

How about an auction of 1♠-2♥-3♥-3♠? and then 4nt happens either right away or after cue bidding.

After having this auction we agreed that it's rkc for the suit supported by the 4nt bidder, hearts for the opener and spades for the responder in this case. ie. as opener with a spade suit of KQJxxx and hearts Kxx I will always play in spades but want to rkc on hearts.

[Zelandakh]

ggwhiz, on 2015-July-06, 10:09, said:

How about an auction of 1♠-2♥-3♥-3♠? and then 4nt happens either right away or after cue bidding.

You can also agree to make this 6KCB if you like.

[ArtK78]

In order to bid RKCB in spades, responder must force to game and then bid spades (or do both at the same time). There must be clear agreement that spades are trump and that the partnership is in a game forcing auction.

In my partnerships, a 2/1 response followed by a bid of opener's first bid suit is forcing to game agreeing opener's suit as trump. So, it is a simple matter to make a 2/1 followed by a spade bid followed by RKCB if that is what you are trying to accomplish.

If a simple spade bid is not game forcing in your system after a 2/1, then you either have to jump to 3♠ or bid 4th suit forcing and then bid spades. Then you follow up with RKCB.

Hopefully the auction will not get too confusing. If it takes several rounds of bidding before responder supports opener's first suit, the raise may seem like a mere preference. But that is something you have to work out with your partner.